Talk:Roy Williams (coach)

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Someone should mention his various coach of the year awards. Remember 18:56, 24 March 2006 (UTC)

The so-called "controversy" over Roy Williams leaving Kansas was really not controversial. Given the scope of College Basketball media coverage, this was a very small event in College Basketball History, and likewise a small event in the history of Roy Williams. He has been covered by the media countless times, and this was one of the many times, but it was not an event that should be the biggest section of his biography. Giving a small event like this the largest section in his biography is inappropriate and likely malicious. Until this paragraph can be edited down to reflect the scope of its importance (very little), the paragraph will be removed.

That's a good point. KU fans were upset (rightly so) but it was a small ripple in the sporting world at large. I'll take a look at the section, if that hasn't been done already. Dubc0724 16:24, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

Actually, it was covered more extensively than any other coach who has left one program for another in recent years. This was due much in part to Mr. Williams own actions during this time, which included cursing on national television, and having long, drawn out, and public crying sessions.

[edit] Kansas Violations Section

This section seems to be getting a bit long, especially in proportion to the entire article. I tried to trim out the long block quote to save some space, as it's redundant information. That trim was quickly reverted on the grounds that a block quote was used above it. Ignoring the apples/oranges comparisons of the two quotes, I'd assume that the reader can read the sources without having to be spoon-fed? What say ye fellow editors? Dubc0724 16:19, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

I am less for cutting down content as I am for adding more content to make that section seem smaller. I agree that both the Kansas violations and the move from Kansas were not huge events that should dominate the page, but the fact that they dominate the page probably has more to do with the lack of any other content. I won't object to you cutting down these sections, but I think time would be better spent beefing up other aspects of Williams' past. Remember 16:44, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

That's a good way to look at it, and probably a better way to handle it. Thanks, Dubc0724 18:24, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

As a Duke fan, even I have to say that that section is WAY too long. A block quote is definitely not necessary and should be summarized concisely. In the large scheme of Roy Williams' life, that incident is just a blip and deserves one paragraph MAX, in my opinion. -Bluedog423^Talk 04:10, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

Good luck shortening it - been there, tried that... Dubc0724 13:06, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

Why should KU's probation be mentioned when it was imposed in late 2006, and has nothing to do with the Williams violation? The paragraph referencing Gene Marsh said there should be no penalties. Ebtunc2006 23:59, 25 February 2007 (UTC)

Wiiliams admitted breaking the rules; gifts of any sort are not allowed. The NCAA is notorious for using past violations in its determinations. You also violated Wikipedia: 3RR with your edits and a report has been filed. Duke53 | ^Talk 00:26, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

Not aware of this 3 edit rule. I will not do that again. Cite where it says that he is a direct result of the violations. This belongs on a Kansas basketball page, not a Roy Williams page. How about we attempt to have this mediated? Ebtunc2006 00:31, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

You should reference the 3RR article where it mentions: Reverting unsourced or poorly sourced controversial material about living persons (see Wikipedia:Biographies of living persons). Your reference to KU's violations in regards to Coach Williams are considered "controversial material." I haven't broken any rules. Good day, dukie Ebtunc2006 00:45, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, you broke the rule; funny how you went from being unaware of the rule to being an expert on it so quickly. Nothing controversial about the item you repeatedly deleted. Clear case of a 3RR violation. Duke53 | ^Talk 01:08, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

I read the 3RR article after you turned me in for it. Funny how you turn me in on it when you are apparently familiar with the exceptions to the 3RR policy. Clear case of misuse of 3RR. You appear to be an instigator here on Wikipedia. I will revert as much as I please considering this is controversial information, as you insist on listing a probation that has nothing to do with Coach Williams, and is already sourced in the article. Ebtunc2006 03:21, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

So, how shall we approach this in a civil manner? The compliance department and outside boosters are the reason for the violation. There is a detailed section on Coach Williams' violation, which he admitted to. Gene Marsh did not penalize Coach Williams or the Kansas basketball program for the gifts given to graduating players who had exhausted their elegibility. I am in no way suggesting removing the information about Coach Williams' admitting to a violation, but associating him with Kansas' probation makes no sense, because he was not responsible for it. This appears to simply be an attack by a Duke fan to discredit Coach Williams by associating the Kansas probation w/ Coach Williams. The Kansas probation would be more fitting on the Jayhawk basketball wiki.Ebtunc2006 05:02, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

I have reverted to version prior to dispute. I would appreciate other parties weighing in on this discussion. Ebtunc2006 05:11, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

I have found and sourced an article relating directly to the violation in question. This is more appropriate than a blanket statement about KU's probation. KU's probation deals with - as stated in the sourced article - men's football and women's basketball. Ebtunc2006 17:43, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

Ebtunc's latest edit, with the source he provided, seems to settle up this edit war. Sanctions were imposed, but not against men's basketball. Unless there is further info, let's leave it at that. -- Pastordavid 18:45, 26 February 2007 (UTC)