Talk:Myself ; Yourself
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[edit] Regarding "official" romanization of names
In this case I think the "official" spellings of character names are only the kanji spellings, and romaji is just something derived as a side from the pronunciations. Hence IMHO using a more consistent romaji would not be "breaking" any "official" spelling. Specifially, "Syusuke Wakatsuki" uses a combination of macronless hepburn and kunrei-shiki romanization, neither of which is the Hepburn romanization, "Shūsuke Wakatsuki," as reccomended by Wikipedia policy/guideline page WP:MOS-JA. Perhaps the romaji may have been something a graphical artist chose on the fly. There seems little reason to believe that the spelling has some sort of significance or agreement by the anime team.
I think at some point we have to use our own manual of style here at Wikipedia as opposed to incorporating every single spelling inconsistencies, spelling mistakes and other idiosyncrasies with doubtful officialness, esp. when the country's artists make frequent English spelling and grammer mistakes. —Tokek 22:15, 11 October 2007 (UTC)
- Just so you know, it has nothing to do with the anime. The game developers themselves chose that way to romanize his name, and his sister's name, and I was under the impressions that under WP:MOS-JP#Names of modern figures, we were supposed to:
- Use the official trade name if available in English/Latin alphabet.
- I was going under the premise that we were supposed to follow this guideline, and if you don't like it, I would then suggest taking it up at WP:MOS-JP, otherwise the unorthadox, but otherwise completely official trade names, should stay.--十八 02:01, 12 October 2007 (UTC)
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- No, I was not complaining about WP:MOS-JA and I don't have any problems with it including the section that you mentioned. I have always been in favor of using official spelling. —Tokek 04:44, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
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- Apparently I gave the wrong impression that I was against WP:MOS-JA although the way in which I referenced it may have suggested that I was for it. In this case, what I am questioning is the officialness of the referenced spelling. Certainly a human being came up with the spelling (allegedly a "developer"). But is there enough reason to consider this as an "official trade name?" I think not, which is why in the first sentence I said that I think only the kanji names are "official." Keep in mind the game, anime, etc. are only marketed in Japan so far. Googling the official webpages for "Wakatsuki" returns: zero hits, zero hits, and no romaji on the characters list page of the official anime page[1]. Is "Syusuke Wakatsuki" an easy to make romaji mistake in a country that makes many romaji/English mistakes or is there some sort of artistic or other meaning behind this particular spelling anomaly? Or is it even in line with the latest trends in deviations from romanization standards? (This question might pose an interesting angle from a linguistic perspective if there is such a trend.) Judging from my knowledge of romanization usage, it looks doubtful. —Tokek 11:46, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
- I can tell that you're speculating on how official these names are, and whether they were just made on the fly, or thought out about and put that way for a reason. Unless you can find some interviews or something, speculating leads to original research, so I don't think there's even a reason to be discussing something that cannot be changed.--十八 22:52, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
- Of course I am NOT speculating, trying to inject original research, demanding that WP:MOS-JA be changed, etc. etc. It is a fact that the romanization is incorrect by any standards, and it is not reasonable to make the assumption that this is an official latin alphabet spelling when it's not even marketed outside of Japan and neither of the official sites contain the spelling in the HTMLs' text. Whoever made the edits to the article made the assumption that this spelling error is official spelling: is there reason to believe this claim when these characters already have official kanji names? The assumptions you are basing your views upon is what I am questioning. The anime page and the visual novel page can't even agree whether the title of this work is "Myself;Yourself" or "Myself ; Yourself." This should be a hint of some sorts. —Tokek 00:24, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
- IMO, it's better to go by the company that made the product first to figure out what is "more" official, hence why the article title has spaces between the semi-colon, and why the romanizations of those two characters were kept. You keep bringing up the fact that the kanji names are the most official (and yes, they are), but it makes no difference when we're discussing romanization techniques for those kanji. I'd be willing to bet that magazine advertisements for the game uses the same romanization of those two characters.--十八 00:47, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
- Of course I am NOT speculating, trying to inject original research, demanding that WP:MOS-JA be changed, etc. etc. It is a fact that the romanization is incorrect by any standards, and it is not reasonable to make the assumption that this is an official latin alphabet spelling when it's not even marketed outside of Japan and neither of the official sites contain the spelling in the HTMLs' text. Whoever made the edits to the article made the assumption that this spelling error is official spelling: is there reason to believe this claim when these characters already have official kanji names? The assumptions you are basing your views upon is what I am questioning. The anime page and the visual novel page can't even agree whether the title of this work is "Myself;Yourself" or "Myself ; Yourself." This should be a hint of some sorts. —Tokek 00:24, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
- I can tell that you're speculating on how official these names are, and whether they were just made on the fly, or thought out about and put that way for a reason. Unless you can find some interviews or something, speculating leads to original research, so I don't think there's even a reason to be discussing something that cannot be changed.--十八 22:52, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
- Apparently I gave the wrong impression that I was against WP:MOS-JA although the way in which I referenced it may have suggested that I was for it. In this case, what I am questioning is the officialness of the referenced spelling. Certainly a human being came up with the spelling (allegedly a "developer"). But is there enough reason to consider this as an "official trade name?" I think not, which is why in the first sentence I said that I think only the kanji names are "official." Keep in mind the game, anime, etc. are only marketed in Japan so far. Googling the official webpages for "Wakatsuki" returns: zero hits, zero hits, and no romaji on the characters list page of the official anime page[1]. Is "Syusuke Wakatsuki" an easy to make romaji mistake in a country that makes many romaji/English mistakes or is there some sort of artistic or other meaning behind this particular spelling anomaly? Or is it even in line with the latest trends in deviations from romanization standards? (This question might pose an interesting angle from a linguistic perspective if there is such a trend.) Judging from my knowledge of romanization usage, it looks doubtful. —Tokek 11:46, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
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- So the question becomes whether or not we should draw a line on what to accept as official. With the "Myself;Yourself" spelling, I was referring to the official anime website - the title of this page [2]. Variations include semicolon without spaces around it, semicolon with spaces around it, and zenkaku semicolon without spaces around it.[3][4] The anime logo[5] appears to lack any space before the semicolon. —Tokek 05:05, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
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[edit] About the Light Novels
I believe the last chapter comes in the January 2008 issue not November 2007 as stated in the article. Kraker2k (talk) 23:28, 7 December 2007 (UTC)
- The January 2008 issue of Dengeki G's Magazine was published on November 30, 2007.--十八 04:26, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
- That is quite odd, publishing something a month before its due out. Is it common practice?--Kraker2k (talk) 15:19, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Music
I think they should be listed in point forms. 64.180.175.41 (talk) 16:36, 22 December 2007 (UTC)
- Per WP:EMBED, embedded lists are generally discouraged in favor of prose.--十八 01:38, 23 December 2007 (UTC)
- The list/prose article mentions "In some cases, a list style may be preferable to a long sequence within a sentence" The songs in the paragraph are just a long list, would it not look better as a small list in the middle of the paragraph?Kraker2k (talk) 14:51, 27 December 2007 (UTC)
- This way of formatting was meant to save space and make the content flow nicely from one thing to another while trying not to be akward about how it is read or received. Since most of the rest of the article is formatted in this fashion (save for the list-like formatting of the characters, and the imbedded list for the short stories), I do not agree that it needs to be altered. But as you say sometimes it calls for an imbedded list, which is why there is one in the afformentioned light novel section.--十八 17:17, 27 December 2007 (UTC)
- Doesn't really have to be a list .......... Just * and name after would be good enough. 64.180.175.41 (talk) 15:42, 14 January 2008 (UTC)
- This way of formatting was meant to save space and make the content flow nicely from one thing to another while trying not to be akward about how it is read or received. Since most of the rest of the article is formatted in this fashion (save for the list-like formatting of the characters, and the imbedded list for the short stories), I do not agree that it needs to be altered. But as you say sometimes it calls for an imbedded list, which is why there is one in the afformentioned light novel section.--十八 17:17, 27 December 2007 (UTC)
- The list/prose article mentions "In some cases, a list style may be preferable to a long sequence within a sentence" The songs in the paragraph are just a long list, would it not look better as a small list in the middle of the paragraph?Kraker2k (talk) 14:51, 27 December 2007 (UTC)
![[5]](http://www.yetigame.jp/myselfyourself/top.jpg){kind=link}