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More information about this article... The following comments have been left for this page: Good job on finding sources. Just some notes: needs some spell-checking and also refs go after punctuation, not before. For sources, try to write out the complete source -- see {{cite web}} or WP:CITE for help on how to write out web references (needs title, url, publisher and accessdate at least..... Is there anything more about him that can be explored? plange 04:13, 23 August 2006 (UTC) (edit)

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[edit] Copyvio

The page has contained a large amount of material apparently copied from AIC's webpage, added in an unwikified chunk by an anon in August. I have removed the material. Part of the original material: * [http://www. caribvoice. org/Business/chinchang.html Two fund managers] was blocked by the spamfilter. Guettarda 21:05, 31 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Edit war

It seems that there is a bit of an edit war going on with this page, especially over the image. I have now put the standard Biography template in there. Please please please - if anybody wants to change this back to how it was before, can they explain why on here first. I have also reverted the image back to the hires image as shown here - same applies to this. Blowski 17:50, 21 August 2006 (UTC)

I have now thoroughly rewritten this article, and can those users attempting to use weasel words to express their point of view please discuss the matter on this page first. The most interesting and relevant thing about Lee-Chin are his career background, his current investments, and his philanthropic activities. If you want to make a proper contribution to the article, please focus on expanding these areas, instead of wasting time in an edit war about whether he is black, blasian, Chinese, Jamaican, etc. Also, I need more (reliable) sources, as there does not seem to be much on the internet. If anybody could provide these, I would be grateful. Blowski 18:19, 23 August 2006 (UTC)

• • Thanks. --M@rēino 19:14, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
  • P.S. I'm adding a link to Chinese Jamaican, since a lot of readers might be surprised to learn that there's any Chinese of any sort on the island. --M@rēino 19:16, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
    • The reason I removed Chinese Jamaican, and the reason that I'm removing it now, is that it was not discussed here first. We should allow 48 hours before making any further changes to the wording of that paragraph to allow those with a specific interest in this article (i.e. Guettarda and Whatdoyou) to also have a say on the structure of the sentence. In my belief, it is one of the least important sentences in the whole article, but this is my suggestion for how it should be written. I will put messages on the other users' talk pages to invite them to respond, but in the meantime, please do not revert the article from how I have left it.

He is of mixed Afro-Caribbean Jamaican and Chinese ancestry.

• Whatdoyou and I, the two main contributors to this article before your (extremely useful and helpful) contributions, both agreed to the term Chinese Jamaican. I believe that by removing it, you are upsetting an agreed-upon balance -- and, more importantly, removing something that is verifiably true. I'll wait 48 hours, but I think there is a presumption for its inclusion, and that it should be included unless you can prove it false. --M@rēino 19:58, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
  • I'm not sure that Chinese Jamaican is a commonly used or understood term, and so this sentence better explains it. My recommendation:

He is of mixed Afro-Caribbean Jamaican and Chinese ancestry.

Blowski 20:27, 23 August 2006 (UTC)

• • • I've found some more information about his parents, and as a result, have re-written the entire paragraph in a way that explains it objectively and comprehensively. If you disagree, please feel free to revert the changes, and comment here. Blowski 07:55, 24 August 2006 (UTC)

• I rewrote the first bit to clarify that his monoracial-Asian grandparents were Chinese Jamaican, in the same way that any Italian person who moves to America is Italian American; you don't have to be born somewhere or be biracial to be a hyphenated person. --M@rēino 15:56, 24 August 2006 (UTC)

OK, I've rewritten that to make that point clearer. Blowski 17:11, 24 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Third generation immigrant

What does that really mean? If two of his grandparents were Jamaicans, then why call him "third-generation immigrant"? Guettarda 04:24, 23 August 2006 (UTC)

As above, there was a disagreement over how Jamaican (and specifically black) and how Chinese he is. This was the compromise that I managed to get through. I thought it was a fairly standard term, but obviously not. Am stuck for what else to write on there at the moment... Blowski 05:41, 23 August 2006 (UTC)

Actually that's a separate issue - "Jamaican" is not synonymous with "black" (see Eddie Seaga, for instance). The current wording isn't accurate - he doesn't have "Chinese and Jamaican" parents - he has Chinese and Afro-Jamaican grandparents. His parents are Jamaican, regardless of race. Guettarda 18:19, 23 August 2006 (UTC)

OK, good point well made. Is that better? Blowski 18:32, 23 August 2006 (UTC)

• Agreed. Jamaican is not an ethnicity any more than Canadian. As a side note, I think the reason that everyone is focusing on this minor point is that the rest of Michael Lee-Chin's bio is uncontroverted. It's not like he's a Kenneth Lay with a shady business past, or a Ted Turner with an inspiring and wacky business past. He made his money, as far as I can tell, in relatively boring fashion.--M@rēino 20:02, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
  • Exactly - Wikipedia is not a tabloid attempting to uncover 'shady pasts', but an encyclopaedia attempting to provide information to those who need it. Blowski 20:29, 23 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Point

This article looks great! Whatdoyou and Mareino GOOD JOB. It just needs better sourcing.—Preceding unsigned comment added by 208.49.22.2 (talk • contribs)

[edit] References

Ref 5 (Michael Lee-Chin: Encyclopedia (in English). About.com. Retrieved on 2006-08-23) comes from a WP mirror, and is an old version of this page (which was a copyvio of his bio from the AIC site, e.g. http://www.aic.com/en/PDFs/AIC5007ENG.pdf). However, neither the About.com mirror nor the AIC version actually supports the statement "His mother sold Avon products, and worked as a book-keeper for various local firms, while his step-father ran a local grocery store". Guettarda 18:02, 24 August 2006 (UTC)

OK thanks for that, I didn't realise. I'll check the reference, but I've definitely seen it in a few places. I'm trying to work out how to cite the same reference multiple times. Blowski 18:11, 24 August 2006 (UTC)