Talk:Loneliness

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It seems to me that a section should be added to this article that adresses lonliness from an evolutionary point of view. Something to the effect: In the past humans were best able to survive by joining together in groups. Those who possesed dna that influenced them to desire to gather in groups had a greater chance of survival, and in turn, a greater chance of having children who possesed similar dna. Over many generations this trait was selected and now, in the present day, almost everyone has a desire to seek human companionship. Of course, this is only half of the story. I would guess that the rest would be concerned with modern lifestyles and the fact that we are no longer dependant on a group for survival, but we still retain the gentetic need for human companionship, which of course manifests itself as "lonliness". Evolutionary ethics has produced much on the subject of group selection, and I'm sure that this topis has been dealt with elsewhere.

"Loneliness is the only disease that can be cured by adding two or more cases together." I completely disagree with this statement. Is it really accepted among sociologists? Eagle 17:43, Apr 29, 2005 (UTC)

What does it even mean? I am lonely right now. :(

It means putting two lonely people together will make both of them cease to be lonely. — Phil Welch 07:08, 20 August 2005 (UTC)

It's just a quip and not necessarily true, but logically it works: put 2 lonely people together and they are no longer lonely. --realwingus 09:39, 31 August 2005 (UTC)

I believe that somtimes you can be lonely even when you're surrounded by people, the meer presence of people arround you doesn't necessarily relieve a person's loneliness it is rather reconnecting with those around you that will help you break it. Izzy - Jordan

I believe what was meant by the 'quip' was that putting two of the same cases of loneliness together, those who cannot connect for the same particular reasons, is what cures loneliness, not just putting any two random lonely individuals together. Nagelfar 02:33, 1 May 2006 (UTC)

1 My Reasoning on Loneliness
2 Quotes Section
3 Solitary Confinement as Torture
4 Delinking years
5 Causes of Loneliness
6 Cancer and Loneliness
7 Off topic sentence in introduction
8 Psychological Tests/Detection Measures
9 Removed website
10 self medication.
11 Cancer
12 Two different types of loneliness
13 Question

[edit] My Reasoning on Loneliness

"Often, people mitigate loneliness by interacting with others via the Internet. However, it is widely believed that purely online relationships are no substitute for in-person relationships, an opinion based at least partially on the fact that a person's true identity is very difficult to determine on the Internet."

Now, people can do this in real life, and they may be unable to tell their true intentions or personality, particularlyif the person has Autism or Asperger's Syndrome. I think that should be noted in there...it's not Online-Only...

As well, some people may be lonely but not by choice..they may be ostracized, kicked out of groups, abandoned by friends, hurt by their parents...the list goes on and on. Some people like me even give up on trying to make friends from all the betrayals they've been through. Why would you keep trying to make friends when every time, it ends the same...with someone turning on you and harassing you?

That is my argument that loneliness may be a requirement at times.

User:Raccoon Fox Talk 01:39, 28 June 2006 (UTC)

I agree here with fox. Like me, I usually become friends easily with someone and then they suddenly lose interest in me, and I'm alone again. I've been also ostracized in my life, and there isn't a whole lot I can do. This article is right though, it can lead to an anti-social behavior. I don't like people in general, simply because I always feel I'm wronged, or that it's ok to abuse me. I resent those who have abandoned me, and my trust in others can be shaky, but I'm very warm at heart.--Hellogoodsir 22:13, 12 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Quotes Section

Not that these aren't all cool quotes, but does this section belong? Usually quotable topics just have a link to the wikiquote page at the bottom. Powrtoch 21:59, 14 September 2006 (UTC)

I think it is a good section to the page, but quotes from like Naruto should be eased up on. Princess Diana and Mother Teressa are examples of the ones that people will take more seriously seeing as they come from real world icons.--Chicito21154 22:06, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

I think the quote is actually quite witty. What do you have against pop culture references? MadMaxDog 14:56, 21 September 2006 (UTC)

I got nothing against pop culture references. But people with a more serious personality might think of it in a more negative way. I have edited my above statement to get my point more clear. --Chicito21154 18:20, 21 September 2006 (UTC)

I feel most quotes from pop culture lack significance. Where do we draw the line when it comes to what is a "good" quote? Chapium 07:17, 5 November 2006 (UTC)

Chapium, we don't draw a line. Some people add, some people delete quotes, and some people revert other people's edits. I would find it very hard to get a consensus on what is an 'appropriate quote' (or even to find a definition!). So at best, we could discuss and find consensus (or majority decision) on individual quotes here on the discussion page. MadMaxDog 09:23, 5 November 2006 (UTC)

Then a vote it shall be. In an effort keep the best quotes on the topic, I nominate these for deletion:

   No one can defeat loneliness.    —From the Naruto TV series

-- Witty, but does not stand the test of time and it also is not a quote from someone notable.

Oppose. Wittieness counts, when applied to the subject. And Naruto may be fictional, but in itself notable enough. MadMaxDog 04:50, 6 November 2006 (UTC)

   Loneliness has followed me my whole life, in bars and cars, I can't escape it, I'm God's lonely man. —Travis Bickle in Taxi Driver

-- It mentions the word "loneliness" but does not seem to say anything profound about the topic

Support. Not too big on this one either. MadMaxDog 04:50, 6 November 2006 (UTC)

   If you find yourself struggling with loneliness, you're not alone. And yet you are alone. So very alone.   — From the Despair.com website

-- Again, not from a notable person and is also an advertisement.

Oppose. Wittieness counts, when applied to the subject. I get the point about the ad, but... MadMaxDog 04:50, 6 November 2006 (UTC)

   I am alone, I am not lonely  — Neil McCauly from Heat

-- This is probably a better quote for an article on solitude.

Undecided - not too keen on this one. MadMaxDog 04:50, 6 November 2006 (UTC)

Chapium 18:05, 5 November 2006 (UTC)

Change of tack - I have taken the liberty of moving ALL quotes over to Wikiquote. Can we, instead of arguing over which few we can prune after long discussion, instead argue about which few should remain here? Maybe 3-5? See old versions of the article.

I support the Francis Bacon quote, the Mother Theresa quote and the bloody Naruto quote, just for pop culture kicks. What do people say? MadMaxDog 06:27, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Solitary Confinement as Torture

I have removed a single sentence reference to the application of solitary confinement (as administered in a penal system) as "Torture". The reference was without citations, had a distinct POV, and is not germane to the subject of "Loneliness", since it is a question of ethicals, not one of emotional heath.

Incorrect. Solitary confinement deprives a social animal (man) of one of his most important emotional sustenances - human contact. Therefore it is torture, as shown very well in the related Pit of despair article I quoted in my revert and which is also in the 'see also' section.

I do not have the time at the moment, but I will eventually get around to research this better and provide citations and expand that part... MadMaxDog 07:47, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Delinking years

Good move, MadMaxDog. The obsession with linking every ref to years in WP articles is as silly as linking to every other noun we use. Well done, chum. Trevor H. 23:23, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

I've seen some people delinking years with bot assistance. Wonder if they ever face any concerted opposition (more than individual complaints). Style manual certainly seemsto imply that date linkage should be relatively scarce. Also, year links must be one of the least-clicked type of links... MadMaxDog 05:28, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Causes of Loneliness

I'm posting here mostly in the hope of instigating some discussion on this, not making changes to the page. I think to often loneliness is seen as a form of mental unwell-ness like depression to be 'fixed' instead of a form of sensory awareness, like being hungry or being in pain when you hit your thumb with a hammer.

Human beings are social creatures. They need to be properly connected to a larger social network to ensure their survival from a very early age. If people fail to make the proper connections, are removed from that network, cut off or lose key ellements that connected them to it the human body will react on an emotional level. I think loneliness can be seen as part of a warning system, like hitting your thumb with a hammer, to alert one that something is wrong.

Attempting to fix it then, thru superficial measures, is probably a mistake. I think a lot of people would actually rather experience it then make believe the underlying problems dont exist or dont matter.

I think that that aspect of being human, the need to be properly connected to a larger social network, is such a personal matter and so tightly wound up with so many other complex bits of business that its very often overlooked or has its importance underestimated.

(Bighousen 11:05, 28 December 2006 (UTC))

Hello Bighousen. Please post new material at the low end of the (talk) page! As for your above comments, I do believe you are right, and that this is partly adressed already. Please feel free to add material (referenced if possible). Thanks and have fun editing. MadMaxDog 06:27, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Cancer and Loneliness

This statement seems to be more a case of urban myth. It's stated in the article that there is an association between loneliness and cancer. However, I have not seen literature that lays claim to this relationship. Further, in general there is no known mechanims for mental health stimulated cancer. If there were a relationship, one could hardly make an argument for causative correlation. Additionally, the comment doesn't state which type of cancers are associated with lonliness. Cancers are heterogenic, which just means that they have different etiologies. Thus, it's not prudent to make such a blanket statement. R. Lopez.

[edit] Off topic sentence in introduction

Does the last sentence of the first paragraph seem a little off the beginning topic. The paragraph is talking the meaning, feelings, conditions, effects of loneliness, etc, then out of the blue it talks about the word lonely. It is an interesting piece of information but it seems it should be in another section on the etymology or history of the word. Perhaps another topic altogether. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.150.203.74 (talk) 22:20, 1 February 2007 (UTC).

Not necessarily. In articles that do not have a full etymology subsection, something like that often crops up at the end of the introduction. MadMaxDog 05:52, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

I don't know, thats the thing with statistics, they're daft. Maybe the loneley person is depressed and eats lots of rubbish, that increases the risk of bowel cancer? who knows Kosta —Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.136.123.45 (talk) 22:44, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Psychological Tests/Detection Measures

Does anyone know of/would it be useful to list any psychological inventories and measures that test for feelings of loneliness? I've heard of the Woodward Loneliness Inventory, but I'm having trouble locating and learning anything about any others. -MyOwnLittlWorld 17:37, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

Feel free to add something, if it is relevant. We can always extend later or stick a section-stub on it. MadMaxDog 07:43, 4 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Removed website

This site was removed along with all other external links, I find the facts in it very usefull, but I guess its unrefrenced Overcoming loneliness

The site was removed because it is a 'self-help' type link, which tends to be discouraged on Wikipedia, as there are too many around and they are hard to prove 'valid'. If we allowed these links, people (i.e. the owners) would be adding them to Wikipedia all the time, and we would be hard-pressed to explain which one's were OK and which not. Also, it is not really a link to a notable institution or something similar which would allow inclusion on other grounds.

Finally, such webpages are easy to find on Google, or via link sites which DO specialise in providing such links. MadMaxDog 07:38, 4 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] self medication.

I agree with the talk on this page how someone said that superficially inducing a good self of esteem to negate loneliness is not as good as the real thing. As far as the alcohol, it can be said that many alcoholics are simply self-medicating(Dr. Phil uses this a lot along with others if someone is looking for a celebrity quote), and that Prozac and the likes of it are simply a more socially accepted way of self medicating(although it isn't quite "self" medicating with prescriptions, but it is not forced either). —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Tygone2 (talk • contribs) 14:59, 4 March 2007 (UTC). --Tygone2 15:01, 4 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Cancer

I hope that someone will read this and add this citation for increased risk of cancer among the lonely. The citation is this : Elanor Smith, "Fighting Cancerous Feelings," Psychology Today, May 1988, 22-23

thanks 216.249.63.101 19:09, 4 March 2007 (UTC)Amanda

I'd have no problem with adding something referenced, but can you provide an online source for that? MadMaxDog 05:31, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

Found it myself, no need. MadMaxDog 05:38, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Two different types of loneliness

I think it's separated into two different groups

1. Need for people, social interaction, friends... 2. Need for a companion/life-partner/lover...

[edit] Question

Is loneliness connected to Autism in any way?

Not directly. Certainly, autistic people would have fewer friends, due to their difficulties with communication. At the same time, they likely wouldn't FEEL lonely. At least that's my guess. Ingolfson 06:52, 14 July 2007 (UTC)

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