Talk:Iannis Xenakis

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

	This article falls within the scope of the WikiProject contemporary music, a collaborative effort to improve Wikipedia's coverage of contemporary music subjects. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the project and see a list of open tasks.
Start	This article has been rated as Start-class on the quality scale.
Top	This article has been rated as top-importance on the importance scale.

	This article is within the scope of WikiProject Biography. For more information, visit the project page.	Biography Portal
Start	This article has been rated as Start-Class on the project's quality scale. [FAQ]
	This article is supported by the Arts and Entertainment work group.
More information about this article... The following comments have been left for this page: This page has decent information, however: Background information can be expanded. Flow of the article is highly choppy. (edit)

An appropriate infobox may need to be added to this article, or the current infobox may need to be updated. Please refer to the list of biography infoboxes for further information.

	Greece Portal This article is within the scope of the WikiProject Greece, an attempt to expand, improve and standardize the content and structure of articles related to Greece.
If you would like to participate, you can improve Iannis Xenakis, or sign up and contribute in a wider array of articles like those on our to do list. If you have any questions, please consult the FAQ.
Stub	This article has been rated as Stub-Class on the quality scale. (comments)
???	This article has not yet been prioritized.
Additional information: This article has been checked against the following criteria for B-Class status: Referencing and citation: not checked Coverage and accuracy: not checked Structure: not checked Grammar: not checked Supporting materials: not checked

This article has been automatically assessed as Stub-Class by WikiProject Greece because it uses a stub template. If you agree with the assessment, please remove {{WPGR}}'s auto=yes parameter from this talk page. If you disagree with the assessment, please change it by editing the class parameter of the {{WPGR}} template, removing {{WPGR}}'s auto=yes parameter from this talk page, and removing the stub template from the article.

Contents 1 Formatting 2 Picture 3 External link 4 Greek name 5 List of complete works 6 Complete Work list 7 First link broken?

[edit] Formatting

I just came across this page, the guy seems really interesting but based on the format I feel like I have to read an essay on his whole life to learn anything about him. It would be better if it was split into sections (early life, music style, etc.) I'm sure you guys can come up with something better than me. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.90.152.87 (talk) 20:06, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Picture

I emailed the webmaster of http://www.iannix-xenakis.org about the use of pictures on that site. The following is the email I sent:

Dear Webmaster, I am an editor at the English version of Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org). Currently, the article on Xenakis contains no picture. I wish to inquire as to the copyright status of the pictures of Mr. Xenakis featured on your site. I would love to use one or more of them in the article. If the copyright belongs to you, would you allow the pictures to be used on Wikipedia? We can only use your materials if you are willing to grant permission for this under the terms of the GNU Free Documentation License. This means that anyone will have the right to share and, where appropriate, to update your material. You can read this license in full at: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Text_of_the_GFDL The license expressly protects authors "from being considered responsible for modifications made by others" while ensuring that authors get credit for their work. There is more information on Wikipedia's copyright policy at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Copyrights If you agree, I will credit you for your work in the resulting article's references section. Thank you for your time.

The following is the reply:

Dear Sir, As all the images that are on our website are free of rights, you can use them without forgetting to mention that it comes from Les Amis de Xenakis. Best regards, F.R. Nupin, webmaster

I think that clears it up, right? I'm going to post a picture from that site now. Chris 15:28, 22 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] External link

xenakisword.com is dead --Nkour

Good to know. Hyacinth 02:05, 24 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Online supplement to "Xenakis: his life in music." is located at http://www.uoguelph.ca/~digimus/xenakis/index.html

Lots of score and audio examples.

I didn't add it to the external links, but if anyone else finds this a valuable resource, please do.

206.248.157.221 21:33, 27 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Greek name

I had only ever seen it spelt Γιάννης Ξενάκης (still, I didn't have many sources to compare) in Greek until I saw this page. I did a Google search and discovered that Γιάννης Ξενάκης returns more than twice the results of Ιάννης Ξενάκης. The gamma is obviously silent since Greeks themselves have a tendency not to write it, and I think it must be correct (why else would anyone put a gamma there); it seems to be written this way by more people, at any rate. I'll go ahead and change it, but if anyone finds more compelling evidence to the contrary, by all means change it back. --Krun 18:38, 11 October 2005 (UTC)

The correct spelling of his Greek name is actually wiithout gamma. See the title page of his book:

http://www.in.gr/books/3enakhs/default.htm

The usual spelling of the name Yanis (John) in Greek is with Gamma, and I suppose that this is the way he spelled his name early in his life. However, during his exile he had to use mostly Latin characters to write his name, and he preferred spelling it with an I accorinding to French usage. I suppose that hes legal name was Ιωάννης like it is for most Greeks who are called Yanis (like most Jacks are officially Johns). The gamma spelling appeared in Greek texts as a back translation of his name from texts written while he was in exile. I hope to get more information from the discussion page in Greek Wikipedia.

I don't understand the reference to parralel fifths and octaves in the story of Xannakis' encounter with Honneger.

May I suggest that an IPA pronounciation or an audible link be added to the head of the article (by someone who knows better than I do exactly what the correct pronunciation is)? TaigaBridge 01:24, 31 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] List of complete works

An anonymous wikipedia user with IP 65.102.229.57 recently added a complete list of Xenakis' works which appears to be copied and pasted from www.iannis-xenakis.org, and so its inclusion in the article could be seen as a copyright violation. I am going to remove it for now.—Tobias Bergemann 09:49, 31 December 2005 (UTC)

How can a complete works lising be copyright violations? Plus the website IS a Xenakis website, not someone owning the list. I don't like your logic. —the preceding unsigned comment is by 65.102.229.57 (talk • contribs)

I am not an expert on copyright issues, and I agree that this is probably a borderline case. However, iannis-xenakis.org lists Radu Stan as "Auteur du catalogue, de la discographie et du calendrier" (under "Crédit"). As the creator of the list he would be the copyright holder, as the compilation of the list is his own work, even though it is a list of Xenakis' works. This (Radu Stan's) list can only be incorporated into wikipedia if he allows the list to be licensed under the GNU Free Documentation License. Of course, anybody can create a complete list of Xenakis' works by himself and put it under any license he likes.—Tobias Bergemann 21:34, 1 January 2006 (UTC)

His list of complete works that is copied from the website leaves out a few of his crucial works, so I thought I'd add them into the list. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Williamcedar (talk • contribs) 04:40, 16 May 2006 (UTC2)

As far as I know, the list on www.iannis-xenakis.org is as complete as it can be. (Radu Stan was responsible for Xenakis' works at Xenakis' publisher Editions Salabert.) It is not the same list that is currently in the article, which is very incomplete. Please feel free to expand the article in any way you see fit. —Tobias Bergemann 07:47, 16 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Complete Work list

Dear all, I am the "anonymous", who had completed the Xenakis work list. I am quiet surprised about the debate that has arisen from this. My source was not www.iannis-xenakis.org, but the official Xenakis work catalogue of Ed. Salabert, available as a printed promotion brochure (distributed free of charge) and a free download version from www.durand-salabert-eschig.com. As a long-standing great admirer of all the works of Iannis Xenakis and a musicologist I have written articles and produced radio-broadcasts on the music of Iannis Xenakis. Besides this since 2002 I am the official promotion representative of Ed. Salabert in Germany, Switzerland, Poland and the former GUS states. So I did not see any problems in making this work list available to the users of Wikipedia. Though I admit this was not a very original contribution, I am somewhat disappointed that my efforts have been deleted now. Best, Michael Zwenzner

Your efforts are not lost as they can be easily restored from the change history of the article. When I removed the list you had inserted it was not because it was "not a very original contribution" but because I was unsure whether you had the right to place the list on the article, thereby automatically putting it under the GNU Free Documentation License. I have since then changed my mind: A complete list of Xenakis' works is probably below the threshold of originality and therefore not protected by copyright law. I think I am going to merge the list back into the article. — Tobias Bergemann 10:21, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

I see that one and a half year later the list of works is still very incomplete. I was specially surprised to realize that absolutely no electronic pieces were included in his "selected works", although the main article correctly states that "[he] is particularly remembered for his pioneering electronic and computer music"... I added at least a few of his most important electroacoustic pieces.--LuisJ (talk) 22:51, 9 May 2008 (UTC)

I know I promised to merge the list back into the article. However, I am not sure if a complete Xenakis works list is really an improvement of the article. After all, the article already contains a link to the works catalogue. Here is the list (as restored from article history):

I won't put the list back into the article myself, but I won't revert it if somebody else does. — Tobias Bergemann (talk) 08:57, 10 May 2008 (UTC)

I was going (when I finally get around doing some work on Xenakis-related articles) to simply create a separate article like the ones we have for so many composers, i.e. List of compositions by Iannis Xenakis (compare with List of compositions by John Cage, List of compositions by Howard Skempton, etc.). We could also make that list into a genre-organized one. Hmm? Jashiin (talk) 14:27, 10 May 2008 (UTC)

That sounds like a nice solution. — Tobias Bergemann (talk) 18:20, 10 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] First link broken?

The first external link appears to be broken. Is it a typo or has it been pulled down?