User talk:Flowanda

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Contents 1 AFM 2 Ron Littlefield 3 University of Phoenix 4 Signal Mountain 5 Current Financial and Legal Issues 6 Affiliate marketing article clean-up 7 Covenant College 8 Destinatons2Discover.com links 9 Anonymous contributions to certain articles. 10 ? 11 Re:Payday loan 12 Your COIN Comment 13 Bose & Reliable Sources 14 revert to payday loan? 15 A reply to your question 16 3RR warning 17 Re:Payday Loan 18 Stanford Shopping Center 19 "removed inaccurate statement and source-please see talk page for rational" 20 Amazon Prime - "Removed excessive details/costs for similar programs on single product" 21 Barnstar 22 George Orwel 23 Snowflake Schema 24 Landmark Education page 25 Tracing IPs to PR firms 26 Prentice 27 eHow 28 Spamstar of Glory 29 Aristocrunk 30 Kellen 31 Hey 32 All Star Cashville Prince 33 Fat Joe/Papoose Feud 34 Sharan Burrow 35 Jack O'Brien 36 Still Pending article edits 37 Matt Brann 38 Your judgements of notability are irrelevant to removal of blue-lks from Dabs. 39 RE:Photo request 40 Re: American Freedom Mortgage 41 Re: Southern hip-hop articles 42 Humana 43 Deletion of sporkforge.com links per WP:EL 44 Warts 45 Why did you delete my link from "Snoring"? 45.1 WTVC 45.2 WTVC 45.3 WTVC#3

[edit] AFM

Oh saviour of Wikipedia, please educate yourself about capital markets and the players in the current "subprime mortgage crisis." Some of your edits are nonsensical and undermine the intergrity of the article. If you do not kno the difference between a broker, correspondent lender and lender, then you may want to only edit articles within your understanding. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.203.153.157 (talk) 05:49, 30 January 2008 (UTC)

See how easy that was? Flowanda | Talk 07:53, 30 January 2008 (UTC)

Hey genious, stop deleting relevant edits. If you want to delete, discuss on the talk page first. Explain and SUPPORT the basis. Unless you are an intellectual property attorney, and I am, it better be good. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.174.79.239 (talk) 04:16, 17 April 2008 (UTC) Loser, you never justified. The same content copied still has the same fair use purpose idiot. You must live with your parents ... or work at a Barnes & Noble.

Please see the disagreements at American Freedom Mortgage, Inc. and Talk:American Freedom Mortgage, Inc. to see why this editor is disgruntled with my edits. Flowanda | Talk 23:59, 6 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Ron Littlefield

Flowanda, please try to be more careful with your edits. Old Money New South is not a self-published book, which is explained on the book's website. Also, if you're going to remove a citation, there may be reason to consider removing the content which required the citation. It's best to bring it up on the article's talk page. Qmax 21:24, 15 April 2007 (UTC)

Qmax, thanks for the welcome and comments. Although I may be new to wikipedia, I consider myself a careful editor who learns and follows style guidelines, so I made edits only after reviewing the appropriate guidelines and doing research in and outside wikipedia.

As you know, the book's website alone is not independent verification of its own authenticity, and the only publisher listed/uncovered with additional research is the author and an organization listed in his name. Regardless, I removed the link because there was no connection between the book and this article; the link you added back contains content with no reference to this article or person.

The other link was removed because it also did not meet the external link guideliness that limit links to only those blogs/personal websites considered authoritative. Although listed as a "collection of essays criticial of the mayor", the web page consisted of entries and comments structured in a blog format by date using blogging software on a website of blogs that included "blogs" in its URL. The blog's writer is unidentified. Whether a blog or personal page, this website doesn't meet the wiki external link guidelines, so I removed the link, noting why in my edits.

I can post all the references I used for these edits, of course, or discuss the edits I've made elsewhere based on wiki sources I used as reference.Flowanda 03:51, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] University of Phoenix

You removed an external link from University of Phoenix with an edit summary indicating there was or is going to be discussion on the Talk page. However, I don't see that discussion. Can you please participate in the discussion about the article if you are going to leave edit summaries indicating as such? Thanks! --ElKevbo 14:29, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Signal Mountain

Sure, I can find time to take a picture this week. The difficulty with Signal Mountain is that it is a ridge (Walden Ridge, to be exact) and there is no "peak" to it. I'll see if I can find a nice angle. I'm thinking of a ridge off Cherokee that would provide a decent image of both that and a better one of downtown. As far as the article, if you're looking to start one on the history of Signal Mountain apart from the town, I suggest calling it History of Signal Mountain. No big deal there. Happy editing to you, contact me any time. Keegan^talk 18:27, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

Oh, and the linked image is from Edward's Point on Signal, the mountain you see in the image is Raccoon Mountain. Keegan^talk 18:28, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

The short squatty one of the bunch, that's for sure...I have always suspected a conspiracy behind the bulldozing of Cameron Hill...those insecure Lookites couldn't stand any competition. Maybe the Conner Tollhouse or the W-Road might be other photo options, but Brady Point still seems to be the standard Signal "view"...along with the space house, of course. You might also try Stringer's Ridge or a safe pulloff along Corridor J (or the road up behind Red Bank School on Mtn Creek) that frames Signal against Raccoon. Flowanda 19:19, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

Here are the pictures:

The Signal image is from the road running up by Red Bank Elementary, as you suggested. I also took a couple images from Komatsu and Suck Creek Road, but this was the best profile.

The Chattanooga image is from Stringer's Ridge. The one I uploaded is from Whitehall Road, but I also took a lesser quality image from Stringer's Ridge Road. I have included the Signal picture to the article. As well, I moved the previous Signal Mountain page to Signal Mountain (disambiguation). Signal Mountain will redirect there until a comprehensive article on Signal is created in its place. Happy editing to you! Keegan^talk 01:49, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Current Financial and Legal Issues

Maybe if you were educated you would recognize that you are not qualified to review legal/financial pages. Such matters are supported by public records. Nicholas.dk —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 66.174.79.236 (talk).

[edit] Affiliate marketing article clean-up

Hi Flowanda, thanks for your message. Your help is very welcome and most appreciated. I left you a note with some details about what was done already and what issues remained and need cleanup at my talk page. Welcome on board :). --roy<sac> ^Talk! .oOo. 03:21, 24 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Covenant College

Flowanda - You undid a deletion I made to the Covenant College entry because you claimed it was done without discussion. If you take a look at the discussion page, you will note that the matter was discussed extensively, and after waiting a couple of months out of fairness, I made the revision that I proposed back in April. Hedgehogfox 04:50, 24 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Destinatons2Discover.com links

Flowanda - destinations2discover.com is producing websites for Conventions and Visitor Bureaus. So they are indeed official websites (paid from CVB's (bedtaxes)) Please do not remove again. Thanks! Worldtraveler1 13:18, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

• Err no, good job on removing the links. Regardless if they are official or not it is still advertising. —— Eagle101^{Need help?} 13:44, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Anonymous contributions to certain articles.

Hi Flowanda. I saw that you have been involved in some article(s) that User:65.15.77.18 has edited (i.e. American Freedom Mortgage, Inc.). It seem that he may have added a significant amount cut and pasted from other copyright sources, if you get a chance to check any that would be great. Rich Farmbrough, 08:35 11 August 2007 (GMT).

I'm assuming this is based on Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents#User:65.15.77.18. Flowanda | Talk 00:15, 12 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit]  ?

Who's Rob? >Radiant< 12:18, 13 August 2007 (UTC)

• I honestly have no idea what you're talking about. >Radiant< 08:02, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Re:Payday loan

Hi Flowanda. Thanks for the heads up - I didn't look back at the other edits that IP had made as the link looked reasonable. I'll keep a sharper eye out in the future. -- SiobhanHansa 01:35, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Your COIN Comment

Hi Flowanda, I was a bit surprised about your comments at the COI Noticeboard. It would be nice, if you could tell me why you believe that I am trying to claim exceptions and discounting edits I don't like. If you read this, you might change your opinion about me. I hope.

1. Quote: "trying to beat a fellow editor to death over a minor article" this was not my choice, somebody else made that choice. I don't let anybody get away who is doing something wrong, only because that would be more convenient. Others contacted me outside of Wikipedia and stated their opinion about the behavior of this editor who "I am trying to beat to death". It seems that he did things the way we did in case of the eComXpo article before that, but nobody spend the time to go up against him to prevent this behavior to be rewarded. You can check out stuff by yourself. I already did the leg work which took me quite some time, but I felt like somebody had to do it. See this. Everything put in chronological order and proven with links to diffs. You can verify everything yourself.
2. Regarding the Affiliate marketing article do you honestly belief that simply deleting 75% of the articles content would make it a better article? That was your proposal, if you support the actions that were taken by a single editor against the opinion of dozens of others in the case of the eComXpo article. On top of that, do it after a failed AfD attempt where only you and one other editor pledge for the deletion while 8 others disagree and proof your arguments being invalid and while the deletion review that you started yourself , acknowledges the decision of the AfD. Only you and the other editor are for overthrowing the decision, while 9 other editors who were not even part of the AfD reject your attempt (with exception of one, the editor who proposed the AfD and now votes to keep it after the debate). Ignore any editors who wanted to help to improve the article after seeing the DRV discussion and make them mad. Ignore their attempts to come to a consensus first and then seek for ratification of your edits and actions afterwards, while pretending to be the nice and fair editor who only wants to help to make Wikipedia a better place. Request mediation where you pull your friend in and then have your friend not accept the mediation request. Hey you tried, didn't you. To prevent other editors to stop you from what you are doing, especially the one that argues the strongest against you, accuse them of something strong enough to discount any of their edits. Sounds bad, doesn't it? I would be surprised if you do anything else but object and state that you would never do something like this. I would believe you.
3. I don't know, but I am not the person who lets that happen and let you get away with it. I stated multiple times that I don't want to spend time on this and made repeatedly attempts to end this. I offered a compromise, a real compromise, but it was rejected. This is the short version of the story. If you interpret the events differently, please let me know. This can not be done in 5 minutes and the one thing somebody is counting on and willing to create as much noise and distractions as possible to keep it that way. --roy<sac> ^Talk! .oOo. 10:29, 8 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Bose & Reliable Sources

I take issue with your comment, "I like my ancient 301s, but I don't think they are contributing to world peace." How do you know these are not contributing to world peace? What's your source for this unjustified attack on Bose's contribution to humanity?

More seriously, thanks for the voice of balance. Mattnad 16:17, 8 September 2007 (UTC)

omibose, you're right. Since I cannot find a reliable source to reference the above statement, we must all then accept that my 301s are, indeed, responsible for world peace. Well, that changes everything, especially my to-do list for next week. Thanks for the heads up. Flowanda | Talk 21:43, 8 September 2007 (UTC)

To see what we're dealing with with UKPhoenix79, here's an exchange regarding your edit to the article, after he changed it: User_talk:UKPhoenix79#Bose. Read down a little. Mattnad 15:05, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

Yes, but we were all right. And '79 was the year my speakers were born. Flowanda | Talk 17:22, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] revert to payday loan?

What is the problem with my changes to payday loan? The ones that you reverted are

• the addition of an (correct, verifiable) reference, to replace a ^{[citation needed]};
• a minor change in wording
• the addition of a paragraph break, with no change to the content; and
• a fix to a misformatted reference.

I do not see how these would be controversial. Please let me know. 24.91.134.90 22:13, 9 September 2007 (UTC)

Sorry, I see that you also reverted a paragraph of text that I wrote. Please let me know if you see any problem, or mark unverified assertions, rather than just reverting. Thanks. 24.91.134.90 22:20, 9 September 2007 (UTC)

Please see the article's talk page. Flowanda | Talk 04:12, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] A reply to your question

The COI thread is the oldest thing on ANI and really deserved to be archived, so I'll answer your question here. I'd rather know what Duremine offers and I'd rather the offer were posted in a place where uninvolved volunteers can watchlist and perform basic management. When the eBay thing first came up for discussion at David Gerard's blog and the Wiki.en mailing list a few weeks ago it turned out to be quite difficult to contact the - erm - "vendor." If it helps any to say this, I also write a column for the online publication Search Engine Land where I inform the business community about how to work within Wikipedia's site standards. Durova^Charge! 03:56, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] 3RR warning

You currently appear to be engaged in an edit war according to the reverts you have made on Covenant College. Note that the three-revert rule prohibits making more than three reversions in a content dispute within a 24 hour period. Additionally, users who perform a large number of reversions in content disputes may be blocked for edit warring, even if they do not technically violate the three-revert rule. If you continue, you may be blocked from editing. Please do not repeatedly revert edits, but use the talk page to work towards wording and content that gains a consensus among editors. --ElKevbo 03:35, 12 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Re:Payday Loan

I will look into to it soon. --Thε Rαnδom Eδιτor (tαlk) 20:51, 13 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Stanford Shopping Center

Thanks for doing the tidy up on the SSC page. One question, what was the reason for removing the item about the Simon PG ownership of the buildings, as well as dropping the link to the company's WP entry? JXM 01:48, 7 October 2007 (UTC)

I moved the first tagged internal link to the first graph and only removed the tags around the second reference since the article was short. Does that work? I had removed a couple of paragraphs of brochure copy and artists' references since they were all (except for one, and it was incorrect) redlinked. I also didn't do a search on the artists, so it might be a better idea to move that graph to the talk page so if future articles are added, the info can be easily moved back into the main page...what do you think? Flowanda | Talk 18:01, 7 October 2007 (UTC)

Ah, okay. NM - my bad. I missed the fact that y'd relocated the link to Simon PG to the first paragraph. Removing the rest of the material is fine with me. JXM 02:59, 8 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] "removed inaccurate statement and source-please see talk page for rational"

I am eagerly awaiting your explanation about how the sentence, which has a source which is still active, is inaccurate. -- Scorpion⁰⁴²² 22:05, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Amazon Prime - "Removed excessive details/costs for similar programs on single product"

Don't you think that your sentence is both a bit confusing? "Free shipping for a fee"->do you say it like that in English? I'm not native speaker, but it sure sounds odd to me. If there's a fee you can't call it free. Additionally, I agree that not all this small info about the fees is needed, but informationen shared by all Prime services should still be in there. Just to give some examples:

• Priority 1-day-shipping to most parts of the country
• Being able to share Prime with members of the own household

Do you agree that this information is relevant enough to be on Wikipedia, or do you think otherwise and why? --Natanji 19:26, 13 November 2007 (UTC)

I kinda went overboard on both the edit summary AND the edits...thanks for the nice note. :) I was trying to follow guidelines about including pricing details from WP:NOT#DIR and keep to a general description of the program overall. I do think my edits make sense -- customers do pay a yearly fee for a program that revolves around free or discounted shipping on individual orders. The fact that everyone in a single household can take advantage of it comes across as marketing speak instead of a true benefit...don't you think everyone is going to take advantage of it anyway? And really, every single marketing program and service a company offers doesn't deserve mention, much less an entire section, but Amazon has somehow been able to spin dozens of articles about every single aspect of its company, no matter how notable or interesting. Flowanda | Talk 20:46, 13 November 2007 (UTC)

True. I still thought the part about priority shipping is relevant enough for Wikipedia, because that's the main reason why people are gonna get Prime. Why? Well, I never ever payed any shipment cost on Amazon yet even like this because it was always over €20 or just books, which are free shipping anyway. I hope like this it's okay. Any objections? --Natanji 17:26, 14 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Barnstar

		The Defender of the Wiki Barnstar
		I, Durova, award The Defender of the Wiki Barnstar to Flowanda for proactive work to stop misuse of Wikipedia for commercial purposes before it happens. DurovaCharge! 10:08, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] George Orwel

Why delete the references to Amazon book and the user page of the original author of the disputed content? Nshuks7 (talk) 17:47, 24 November 2007 (UTC)

The page looks like original research to me, and we don't cite Wikipedia articles. We also have to keep WP:BLP in mind. I've started a discussion on the article talk page. Flowanda | Talk 18:04, 24 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Snowflake Schema

Invite you to spot places in the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snowflake_schema article that could be improved.Nshuks7 (talk) 08:03, 30 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Landmark Education page

I invite you to help finish editing the refs on that page. I need a hand with something else as well, if you can. Pax Arcane (talk) 02:26, 6 December 2007 (UTC)

Yes, I was just there looking at recent edits. The edits I made this weekend focused just on moving external links from the main article into citations in the reference section. Although I thoroughly enjoyed reading the article (and what I read from the external link/citations), I still feel I know very little about Erhard from the Wikipedia article itself. The entire first paragraph, for instance, is totally incomprehensible to me -- it just seems like a mess of jargon/corporate/legal/creepy cult speak, which might be fine for the corporate/legal/baptized types, but does nothing for the rest of us. Flowanda | Talk 06:53, 6 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Tracing IPs to PR firms

Hi Flowanda,

Can you tell me how you traced http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/209.183.197.163 to Dezenhall Resources (17 May 2007)? I am doing research on anon. IPs, but sites such as ARIN do not give me information this specific. Are you using an admin tool? Is there any way for me to use this tool?

Thanks, Cyrusc (talk) 21:43, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

• I got it figured out... Please disregard the above. Cyrusc (talk) 19:47, 9 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Prentice

Thanks for helping improve the Prentice article. I have restored your edits and added a couple of citations. Sufferingfools had removed your edit and left what I think is misleading information (perhaps inadvertently). Keep up the good work! Benzocane (talk) 00:20, 10 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] eHow

Hi Flowanda,

I saw that you removed eHow's Writer Compensation Program reference from the eHow Article Page. I'm actually a rep from eHow, and I was wondering if it was okay to make at least two references in the article about the Writer Compensation Program? One, in the body of the text and the other in the external link portion of the page. Thanks. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Revisitingnixon (talk • contribs) 18:56, 29 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Spamstar of Glory

		The Spamstar of Glory
		To Flowanda for diligence in the tireless battle against Linkspam on Wikipedia. --Hu12 (talk) 19:55, 29 January 2008 (UTC)

Many thanks for your tireless efforts in keeping article clear of spam and other nonsense. Wikipedia is a better quality project because of hardworking and conscientious editors like you!--Hu12 (talk) 19:55, 29 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Aristocrunk

Unfortunately I don't have a knack of writing articles on music, I can only butcher them :-). Of people who might have interest in topic, there is Wikipedia:WikiProject Hip hop/Members. Oh, wait, you know the wikiproject exists :-) Since you are talking to me, I guess it is rather inactive. Sigh... I wish I could help. `'Míkka>t 16:00, 14 February 2008 (UTC)

I actually didn't think about going to the project page...duh! Thanks anyway for your help; I think I will just add sources to the article for other editors to use as references and notability checks. Flowanda | Talk 21:37, 14 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Kellen

Hi Flowanda - great work spotting the Kellen link and cleaning out those pages! I haven't done much hunting for Kellen stuff lately, I guess I need to up my game. They're definitely a curse on Wikipedia, the more we can do to eradicate that kind of POV the better. I'll try and take a good hard look at some point in the next few days and see what I can find. Thanks for the heads up. -- SiobhanHansa 23:15, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Hey

Thanks for cleaning up the "driving links" spam. I picked it up via a Commons user who was uploading images there for spamming use & followed the trail. I've blocked one IP & a user and given an "im" warning to another. The help is appreciated, --Herby ^{talk thyme} 11:19, 20 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] All Star Cashville Prince

I've restored the article to its pre-copyvio state; my apologies. Marasmusine (talk) 08:34, 24 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Fat Joe/Papoose Feud

Lol, I can't believe you didn't believe me. look up in google.com right now "Papoose Fat Joe". That's how I found those 3 references about the whole story that I just added. There are also many more too though. I am not trying to be rude, but I do not add fake references to pages. Thanks for watching Fat Joe's page, though! Y5nthon5a (talk) 05:19, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

I was teasing...see your talk page. Flowanda | Talk 06:00, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

Lol, okay man. It's all good. Yeah, and if you want to edit the Fat Joe/ Papoose feud part of Joey Crack's page to make it shorter and whatever else, you can. I was just too lazy to do so. I wrote all that up and then I thought it was too long, but was too lazy to go back and change things up. Yeah, I know about how most things work on this site; i've been on here for over a year. So yeah, you a fan of Fat Joe, or are you just watching his page?Y5nthon5a (talk) 06:36, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Sharan Burrow

Just so you know, she's in the news almost constantly, being the leader of Australia's peak union body. e.g. [1] Orderinchaos 15:01, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Jack O'Brien

No problem. Cheers! MusiCitizen (talk) 16:17, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Still Pending article edits

Hi there. I see that you have been busy editing the Still Pending article. You have really cut out a lot of the article without any discussion of your proposed changes on the article's talk page. You may have noticed that this article has survived a few deletion reviews and AfDs in its original state. Why did you find it necessary to remove so much of the content? The article was well sourced (hence the survival of the deletion reviews). Please review the Wiki policy and guidelines for careful and properly discussed editing of articles. I have reinstated the article back to it's prior version. If you wish to discuss your proposed changes, please use the talk page. Thanks for your contributions to Wiki. PeachWriter66 (talk) 05:57, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Matt Brann

Hi. I'm from the french version of WP (please have a look on my user page). I am really sorry about the sources and edits problems on this page. Despite of long researchs on this musician, I was unable to found better sources about him. I understand that you would like better source than the myspace, but why can't we do with these for the moment? A weak source is better than no source at all. Yours faithfully (I am not sure wether it is the right terms to use...),Dodoïste (talk) 16:10, 5 April 2008 (UTC)

Hi. I couldn't find any current sources either, but I'm sure that will change. I think it's unsourced or poorly sourced content that hurts article more by making them easier targets for deletion. But that's just my opinion. :) Add back what you think is appropriate; I won't make anymore edits unless you want some help with future sourcing. Flowanda | Talk 01:09, 8 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Your judgements of notability are irrelevant to removal of blue-lks from Dabs.

Welcome to Wikipedia. Although everyone is welcome to make constructive contributions to Wikipedia, at least one of your recent edits, such as the one you made to Jack O'Brien (disambiguation), did not appear to be constructive and has been reverted or removed. Please use the sandbox for any test edits you would like to make, and take a look at the welcome page to learn more about contributing to this encyclopedia. Thank you.
--Jerzy•t 20:33 & 22:06, 6 April 2008 (UTC)
You responded to the above with

Based on the vandalism template you placed on my talk page and your comments on User Talk:MusiCitizen#Dab "Jack O'Brien", are you saying that I vandalized pages or tried to purposely mislead other editors as to what I was doing?
--Flowanda | Talk 23:11, 7 April 2008 (UTC)

Short answer: no, neither; nor have i believed either of those to be true.
Before i embark on the long answer, i invite you to indicate whether

1. you grasp that you may not remove an existing article from a Dab page, based on your considering its subject non-notable
2. you can explain your removing the only link main-namespace to Jack O'Brien (disambiguation) from its logical place on Jack O'Brien

--Jerzy•t 02:29, 8 April 2008 (UTC)

Thanks, I understand now; however, placing a level 1 vandal warning on my talk page and belittling the editor who helped fix my errors was overly harsh and unhelpful. Flowanda | Talk 03:31, 8 April 2008 (UTC)

You're of course entitled to your opinions (even when they are about the relationship between two of your colleagues), and under no obligation to forgo expressing them, even by asserting them as facts. But do not expect my thanks for your doing so. And for the record, your insistence on focusing on the contexts where you have previously seen the words i said, rather than on the words or on the substance of the situation that elicited them, leaves me with the opinion that you do not in fact understand, and deepens my concern about the suggestions of reckless editing on your part, which led me to communicate with you in the first place.
--Jerzy•t 06:59, 8 April 2008 (UTC)

I truly do not think we will be able to communicate in an effective way; is there another editor with whom I can discuss this with so I can learn from these mistakes? Flowanda | Talk 16:31, 8 April 2008 (UTC)

Let's not give up so easily! You said you understood, and i may have been too terse, and harsh after you accused me of harshness, in saying so little beyond "not in fact understand". My point was that we still differed about how significant and avoidable your lapses were, but i'm encouraged by your interest in learning more about that, or at least other aspects of the situation. (And besides, i don't really know who to send you to!)

BTW, i finally accomplished what was, for me, a decoding of

working on removing non-notable name from main wikipedia direct

namely

a step toward getting this bio, too obscure to bear the "primary" rather than a Dab-suffixed title among titles beginning with that name, into a new context that reflects that fact.

(Not that you should be expected to say that in terms that clear.)

My difficulties in arriving at that understanding may be part of what you'd value knowing about (and please note i am offering them as potential insights for you, not as evidence of blameworthiness, recklessness, or even, at the moment, seriousness of effect:

1. Experienced en:WP editors use "non-notable", AFAIK, only to mean, regarding a topic, "below the limit of significance needed to justify WP having an article on the topic". Non-notability is something determined on WP:AfD, except in the sense that, within a few classes of topics (usually bands, companies, and individual people), admins applying WP:CSD#A7 implicitly have to rely on a sense of what kinds of claim about a topic constitute claims of notability.
2. The principal use of "main" in en:WP is in "main namespace", meaning the sum total of pages titles intended for articles, lists, redirects, and Dabs, i.e., essentially everything that might be necessary for your browser to get pointed at in the use (without editing) of this encyclopedia.
3. "Directory" in its computing senses is a term that the (software) developers of MediaWiki (the software engine underlying WP) probably deal with regularly, but editors as editors have no use for, let alone any need to abbreviate it. (And i can't imagine that there is a software-directory boundary that separates between suffixed and unsuffixed titles.)
4. I was also trying to read that summary in light of the one i had noticed before it, "removed non-notable name", which, in the context of our common usage of "non-notable" and your removal of the Dab entry for the editor, seemed to imply you anticipated deletion of the bio article you had (illogically) taken the trouble to edit (with the edit-summary i was trying to interpret).

Having finally succeeded, i think, in understanding both of those edits, let me state my new best understanding of what your intentions were:

You wanted the Dab to be titled "Jack O'Brien" and the editor to bear a suffixed version of that title; you set out toward that pretty much by undoing what had previously been done to put him where you found him, intending to then put it back as you (and i) believe it should have been in the first place: you changed the references to him and the Dab on the pages first, and discovered you couldn't, or didn't understand how to, do the moves/renames; you stopped at that point, and asked the other editor to help or finish up.

You may well have other questions in mind, which i'd be glad to try to address, but i'm going to share with you one relevant and fairly powerful insight that i reached years ago, but AFAI recall never verbalized until now. It really has to do with a hidden strength of the move tool, which could better be called the rename tool. Without being sure of the exact mechanics (e.g., what exactly happens if another editor tries to change the contents or existence of the source or destination page, if the renaming editor gets asked, and is still deciding, whether to delete the destination page), i believe the tool does roughly this: copies the contents onto the destination page, and before letting anyone make any other change the source page, replaces its contents with a redirect to the destination page. The point i consider crucial is that from any user's point of view, the contents of both pages seem to change simultaneously.

The reason i make such a point of this is that it provides the solution to the kind of problem that inherently had to exist (long enough that someone could be inconvenienced by it, whether or not the follow-up to your efforts had gone awry), in the case of Jack O'Brien: the problem of the Dab, for the others of that name, disappearing (at least temporarily) from users looking for them, and (less seriously but the other side of an analogous coin) of access to his article from the more complete Dab disappearing. Here's that solution, applied to this case:

1. "Bypass" the chains of lks thru the Hatnote Dab on "Jack O'Brien" (the ed's bio) to the Dab "Jack O'Brien (disambiguation)". You do so by changing any lk to "Jack O'Brien" (no matter where on WP it is), if its context shows that someone else than the ed'r is intended, and you change it into a lk to the corresponding article titles (whose links probably appear on the Dab page). (Any such changes are overdue, but now "bypassing" them becomes crucial.)
2. Make the move/rename of "Jack O'Brien" (the ed's bio) to Jack O'Brien (editor). As a result, the title used by articles that used to appropriately lk to "Jack O'Brien" (for the ed's bio) now lks thru "Jack O'Brien" to the same bio (at its new title Jack O'Brien (editor)), bcz the new "Jack O'Brien" page was recreated (with the content of exactly the needed Rdr) by the move tool when the bio was moved.
3. Now you move the Dab for "Jack O'Brien" from "Jack O'Brien (disambiguation)" to Jack O'Brien. Again, the page you moved from becomes a Rdr, in this case at Jack O'Brien (disambiguation) and lk'g to the new Dab at Jack O'Brien.
4. Unlike the Rdr (from step 2) that you just overwrote (in step 3, by the move), this Rdr will stay there; in fact, it will be used by, e.g. at the Dab John O'Brien, in its "See also" secn, since Jack O'Brien (disambiguation) (rather than the equivalent Jack O'Brien) is the style of lk specified at MoSDab

That's all harder to say (even after doing it over and over and over), than it is to do once you've done it a few times, close enough in time that you start to get used to the routine. And i've probably screwed up the description at some point (or rather, screwed it up at least one more time than i've fixed such screw-ups). You may have to say "Did you mean that?" -- In which case i can either correct it, or say it again in a different way, rigorously checking that my two versions of it mean the same thing.

The basic point to come away with is that when you need to shift lks, you can do it without "gaps" in which the names don't match up right, as long as you rewrite the lks after the move-tool has been used to simultaneously

1. change what title has the content (the Dab or article)
2. hide the corresponding gap (by keeping anyone from trying use the old page between putting the moved/renamed content under the new title, and putting the new Rdr to that new title in place), and
3. thus leave you with the ability to change lks, at your relative leisure, from citing one title (the new Rdr) to citing the new title (where the moved content is).

Of course what you want to know may be something else; try asking me.
--Jerzy•t 06:00, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] RE:Photo request

Hi Flowanda,

I won't be able to take the picture myself anytime soon, as I have relocated away from Chattanooga (I do miss the hills...). Obviously there is no deadline, so when I get back to visit I will take said picture of Ed Johnson's tombstone. If I can't, I'll find a way to get a photo. Thanks for asking me, I'll do the best I can. Keegan^talk 05:13, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Re: American Freedom Mortgage

Hi - thanks for the message. It doesn't appear any infringing text was added to the American Freedom Mortgage, Inc. article. Material released by the United States government is in the public domain, so copying from a .gov site isn't a copyright infringement, although it's not a recommended practice. If those IPs have added other text that's copyrighted, just revert back to the last acceptable version of the article. We don't have to delete those versions or the article unless the copyright holders complain.

I haven't investigated the Phillip E. Hill, Sr. article; if there's no version free of copyrighted text (not from the DOJ sites, but from the other two ELs listed), add a {{db-copyvio}} tag for speedy deletion under WP:CSD#G12. Copyright infringements that have no acceptable version in their history can and should be speedy-deleted. Thanks again for the message, and be sure to let me know if you have more questions or need help. :-) - KrakatoaKatie 22:52, 18 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Re: Southern hip-hop articles

Thanks for noticing my cleanup edits to the many many many southern hip-hop related articles on Wikipedia. As a member of the Wikiprojects of Hip-hop and Fact/Ref check, I get headaches just reading those horribly sourced, biased articles on the south; they're violating WP:BLP! It's really simple to deal with them. First off, everything...EVERYTHING must be properly sourced/attributed to reliable sources. What I've done is watchlisting such articles and then reverting vandalism or unconstructive edits. And of course, if you doubt a certain band's notability, see WP:MUSIC. --Andrewlp1991 (talk) 04:41, 27 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Humana

Thank you for taking the knife to the corporate brochure that was the Humana article. I'm sure there are mounds of corporate brochure articles that could take a similar going-over. Cheers! Stevie is the man! ^{Talk • Work} 13:47, 28 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Deletion of sporkforge.com links per WP:EL

I undid your deletion of these links from 3 articles (IRR, NPV, and DCF), as I believe the calculator the link points to adds unique value to these article. Also, it is not a "commercial" link if it has adds around the periphery (note that you let stand other, less useful links that also have ads on ther pages). Like I said in the revision log, if you find a calculator that does what this one does, then by all means please replace.

I encourage you to study the topics in these 3 articles, then give the calculator a spin for yourself. If you think it doesn't measure up, or is generally lame or not useful, then by all means nix it.

I let stand your other deletions because in those cases the tools weren't unique over all the internet (more or less).

--Cheese Sandwich (talk) 13:16, 9 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Warts

Hello. The site I added is an extra page I created with more pictures of genital warts in an effort to deal with the overwhelming demand people have for pictures like these. I also created an audio on that page to help explain them. Before you edited it out, it had been on the Wiki for over one year without any complaints and also with a relevant disclaimer. Given the fact that the page adds to the content of the article and also serves a need that so many people are desperate for good honest info about, there is no reason why the link should not be there. It has absolutely nothing to do with "nofollow" stuff or search engine stuff or whatever. No money is made as a result of people hitting that page. Therefore, I think it should be added back with the relevant disclaimer like it was before.

Grinc (talk) 20:33, 10 May 2008 (UTC)

It looks like you've been removing other links and in the last edit, you replaced another nn link with yours...neither link is now in the article. Your edit and user talk histories show several other editors have removed your website over the past few years for the same reasons I did, and the topic you added to the article's talk page did not spur discussion or action that indicated the site fit guidelines for WP:EL.

The website is an ad for an ebook; and your page's title content and links promote the sales page. There are also a number of photos already in the article itself, so I'm not sure there's added value linking to other photos.

You might want to take a look at Wikipedia guidelines about advertising and links -- WP:ADVERT and WP:COI provide information on how to appropriately edit articles and add links -- and if you think your links are appropriate, there are several ways to get input and settle any disagreements -- seeking a third opinion is a good place to start. Flowanda | Talk 00:34, 11 May 2008 (UTC)

You have an incredible amount of time on your hands.

Grinc (talk) 19:07, 11 May 2008 (UTC)

Thank you. And you will continue to waste yours if you don't stop spamming. Flowanda | Talk 20:03, 12 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Why did you delete my link from "Snoring"?

My site, www.snore-gonomics.com , is not spam. The main objective of Snore-Gonomics is to educate people about snoring and sleep apnea. Also, my site is much more informative than most of the other links on the snoring page. So can you please explain to me why you deleted my link after it had been there for over 3 months? With all due respect, I think you were wrong to delete my link and I'm putting it back up. —Preceding unsigned comment added by KnowlegeProductions (talk • contribs) 16:22, 19 May 2008 (UTC)

I don't think I can add anything to the Wikipedia policy and guidelines info that you have received from four editors -- it does not appear you have tried to familiarize yourself with any of the pages concerning external links or advertising. And you might want to compare your website disclaimer concerning fair use against Wikipedia's policy concerning copyright violation before readding your link. Flowanda | Talk 01:30, 22 May 2008 (UTC)

What makes you an authority on this subject? I have not broken any of the rules and I don't know what you're getting at about copyright violation. I have not, nor will I ever, violate any copyright laws. The fact is, my link was up for well over 3 months before you decided to "edit" it. Yes, I have adds on my site, but so do half of the links on the Snoring page and you didn't delete them. Also, did you even read the information on my site? It's the most informative and easy to read site about snoring on the whole internet. I challenge you find a better site. I want people to actually be able to learn about snoring and sleep apnea and not have to read everything in doctors terms that they don't understand. So excuse me for being just a small time website. I'm sorry that I'm not as big as WebMD or a site of that nature, but that's not a good reason to single me out and delete my site. I will continue to keep putting my link back up until someone that actually works for Wikipedia tells me that I'm breaking the rules and I doubt that will happen because I am not breaking the rules. —Preceding unsigned comment added by KnowlegeProductions (talk • contribs) 20:11, 27 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] WTVC

I have now conformed the layout of the "personalities" heading of the WTVC article, to appear exactly like KCNC-TV. KCNC-TV is a television station in Denver, whose headings are much more precise and descriptive of specific news jobs within that TV station. There are other TV station articles who also use those exact same headings and listings. I trust this will suffice. Your edits are very helpful, and I appreciate the chance to be concise (sp) and present a confortable page to read. Csneed (talk) 15:03, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

[edit] WTVC

Now I need your help. I changed the WTVC Personalities/On-Air Talent section to reflect the entries in many other TV station articles, but this person: 67.161.231.25, continually insists on including the word "EMPLOYEES" after Personalities and On-Air Talent. No station lists employees, not even WRCB-TV or WDEF-TV also in Chattanooga. Please warn this person to stop editing that word in; it does not conform to Wikipedia standards. Thanks for your help. Csneed (talk) 04:51, 9 June 2008 (UTC)

I'll check it later this evening...deadlines all this weekend. :) Flowanda | Talk 22:57, 9 June 2008 (UTC)

[edit] WTVC#3

I really appreciate your help. I believe the person who keeps making the edits is a former employee at the TV station who is not an on-air personality, but who insists on being listed as an "employee," which does not meet Wikipedia standards. He was deleted for not being an "On-Air Personality" or a "Past Personality." Now he makes changes from different computers to change his IP address, as to be non-traceable. No other TV Station article that I have found in Wikipedia lists "employees," but this person insists on being including in the listings. I have tried to arrange the article and the subheadings to conform with other TV stations with the same format (notably KCNC-TV, Denver), but this person insists on changing the "On-Air Personalities" and "Past Personalities" back to a style that also includes "employees" that does not meet current Wikipedia standards. Any help you can provide, is greatly appreciated. I want to do this the correct way similar to most other stations.Csneed (talk) 13:10, 10 June 2008 (UTC)