Template talk:Benetton Formula

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[edit] Benetton nationality

(discussion transferred from DH85868993's talk page)

I know that Benetton had both the British and Italian nationalities but they finished their career with the Italian one. Therefore, I don't find relevant the fact of saying, before being Italian they were British, Formula one teams have one nationality at the time. Plus, we know that Benetton is an Italian compagny (even if they were based in England) and it's more appropriat leaving only the Italian flag because it reflects the Italian roots of the team.VincentG 01:53, 2 August 2007 (UTC)

The Benetton team has no Italian roots. It stems from the British Toleman team. The Benetton company is Italian, though. Lustigson 12:49, 2 August 2007 (UTC)

Are you serious with that statement? You just said it yourself: the compagny is run by Benetton who are Italian and you say they have no Italian roots? If it's no Italian roots, I don't know what it is. It's the same as Red Bull, they stem from Jaguar but they have taken the Austrian nationality because their boss is Austrian, even if they are based in England, like Benetton. Benetton had the British nationality from 1986 to 1995, because Luciano Benetton had decided so, but unofficialy they were Italian. So your affirmation is somewhat strange to say the least and untrue.VincentG 03:19, 3 August 2007 (UTC)

I'll repeat what I said. Mind the emphasis added: The Benetton team has no Italian roots. It stems from the British Toleman team. Lustigson 10:31, 7 August 2007 (UTC)

As I see it, the flags at the top of the template have nothing to do with the team's "roots" or ownership, they're merely a reflection of the licenses under which the team entered, so I think both flags should be shown, since the team entered using both British and Italian licenses during its history. I don't see why the later (Italian) one should have precedence over the earlier (British) one, especially since neither of them is "current" (because the team is defunct). I think it's a different situation to Jaguar/Red Bull - (as far as I'm aware) Jaguar always entered as British and Red Bull always entered as Austrian. DH85868993 08:23, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

At Lustigson: I will repeat it: It's not important that the team stems from Toleman, it's the ownership that is important. If the team ownership changes and plus the owner is a foreigner, it's his nationality that is important. Anyways, at DH85868993: we'll leave it like that because you're two against one.

I think I lost what this discussion was about. If it was about the Italian nationality/licence/flag being displayed with race results, I concur if the races were post-1996 -- that's when they changed to an Italian licence -- while prior to that, the results should show a British flag. Lustigson 09:14, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

The discussion was about which flag(s) should be shown at the top of this template: just the Italian flag, or both the British and Italian flags. DH85868993 10:37, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

Oh, that. The Italian flag, then. Sorry about that. :-) Lustigson 11:34, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

I've restored both flags. Can we at least get this argument on the right lines? Who owns the team is of no importance. If it was, then the correct flag would be the French one, because in its final year the Benetton team was owned by the French company Renault. I guess no one wants that?

The nationality of a team is determined by which racing authority it is licensed with. As I guess we all agree Benetton is unusual in having raced under two different nationalities: British and Italian. This also has nothing to do with its ownership: Benetton raced as a UK team for 10 years while under Italian ownership.

It was only in 1995 that Benetton decided for marketing reasons to change to Italian registration. In this case the correct response is surely to reflect both nationalities of the team? Happy to discuss. 4u1e 17:00, 29 September 2007 (UTC)