Talk:Agnes of Rome

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Contents 1 Sections / Pages 2 Links 3 Why is this a big deal? 4 Article movement 5 Honor 6 Miracles? 7 Dead link 8 picture - statue? 9 Huh?!

[edit] Sections / Pages

This page should be split up into 3 pages:

• one about the saint
• one about the church of S. Agnese fuori le mura
• one about the church about S. Agnese in Agone

Ehm... Who wrote it? But i think, it is a good idea - it will be possible to set the InterWikis. I wrote the article de:Sant'Agnese in Agone a few minutes ago but the InterWikis between articles and the sections of the articles have no sense! AN 05:12, 25 May 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Links

This page suffers from everything2 syndrome of linking random words.

[edit] Why is this a big deal?

why do people make a big deal out of Saint Agnes? She is not that important so why all the rituals and mass about her? 13 years old girl died because she is a christian and she was excuted for refusing to marry, not mean to be senseless but why waste time on that? It's sad she died an worngful death, her dicision should been repected but it"s better to talk about two churchs bearing her name plus this artical should be short not long.

I wasn't sure if I really wanted to respond, but I feel I have to. I know it seems silly to commemorate saints, but if you are part of the Orthodox or Roman Catholic faith, it is a major part of your daily devotions and prayers. You remember people who have died for the Christian faith - especially those who were severely persecuted in the early years of Christianity. For me, it makes me realize how insignificant MY problems in life are and why it's important to mantain my faith. To each his/her own, but it's not a senseless waste of time IMHO. CWood 00:12, 22 Jan 2005 (UTC)

It isn't really about her or any of the other saints, they are basically proxies for worship, in a way a polytheistic approach to Christianity, where different parts of God's essence is represented in multiple avatars, rather than the single avatar Jesus. So the importance of Satin Agnes has little to do with the actual girl, far more to do with Christians who identify with the part of God she is meant to represent. If you are asking whether it is encyclopedic - yes, simply because of the meaning it has to others. Sad mouse 00:53, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

You have given the reasons why she is important in your question. If it doesn't convince you -- well, that it has convinced other people makes her important. Goldfritha 02:08, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Article movement

I am reverting the recent movement of this article from Saint Agnes to Saint Agnes of Rome for two reasons: (1) No explanation of the move was given in the discussion page as per Wikipedia article movement policy, (2) the move was not opened up for voting by Wikipedia editors and (3) Saint Agnes is known more by the title Saint Agnes not Saint Agnes of Rome (also this is the only major Saint Agnes in existence). --Gerald Farinas 22:24, 8 May 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Honor

Does honor mean hymen? Actually saying hymen would be much more NPOV. Dave 02:29, 21 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Miracles?

As far as my understanding goes, a person must perform miracles after death to be made a saint of the Roman Catholic Church. this article lists the miracle before St. Agnes' death, but does not mention much beyond that. And does anyone know when she was made a saint, and by whom? Just curious. Happy St Agnes Eve! Russia Moore 22:30, 20 January 2007 (UTC)

Usually someone has to perform three miracles before death, but that is a fairly modern thing. Most of the very early saints don't have any recorded miracles, may not have actually existed, and in a large number of cases are actually just the local pagan gods rebadged as Christian saints in an effort to convert the locals (eg St Bridget is almost certainly the pagan goddess Brigid, most of the legends of St Bridget are identical to earlier legends about Brigid, and the early locals considered her to be both saint and goddess). Sad mouse 00:49, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

1. it's after death.
2. it's not required in case of martyrs
3. her canonization occured before the process was thus formalized

As for why she was canonized: she was a martyr. Goldfritha 02:00, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

With respect, that is simply not correct (except for point three, as in early saints didn't have any rules to follow). Martyr is simply someone who was killed for their faith. There have been many many people killed for their faith, far far more killed for their lack of faith, only a tiny minority were turned into saints. Martyr does not equal saint. The best example is probably American Idol. There are thousands of people with equal skill, by chance a few get on the show, by popular choice a few make it big, they are no better than anyone else yet they become famous. St Agnes (if she existed) was just some kid who got killed by religion, no better or worse than any one victim, by chance alone history uses her to represents all of them. Sad mouse 06:16, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

One note: while not all martyrs may be 'turned into' saints (by which I assume you mean, are declared saints by the RC church), that doesn't mean they are not saints according to Catholic teaching. Catholic teaching is that a saint is someone who is in heaven. Being martyred is a quick route to heaven. Those who are formally declared saints are supposed to be those they are sure of, but it doesn't mean others aren't saints. And generally, a martyr is a saint. This doesn't mean I disagree with your points about gods. Oh, and miracles after death, not before, are generally required. Skittle 12:12, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

With due respect, Sad mouse, you're wrong. Goldfritha 19:04, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

How many hundreds of thousands of martyrs are there? How many have been canonised? Obviously, being a martyr is not sufficient. But seriously, who cares? Okay, a billion Christians do, good point. Sad mouse 04:17, 22 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Dead link

• http://www.haverford.edu/engl/engl301/agnes/agnes.htm St. Agnes, virgin martyr

This link seems to be dead. I've put it here in case it's not. Skittle 12:12, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] picture - statue?

caption underneath the image says its a statue? surely not - looks more like a painting to me. Tyhopho 13:05, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Huh?!

The article says that St. Agnes was canonized in 1950. I don't see how this could possibly be correct, as she's been venerated for many, many centuries. Maybe someone's confused? 1950 was the year Maria Goretti was canonized. BLHersey (talk) 01:57, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

The more I thought about this, the more I realized it has to be a mistake, so I'm just changing it myself. BLHersey (talk) 02:45, 21 January 2008 (UTC)