User talk:Zyxw

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Welcome to my talk page. The current date and time is 15 June 2008 T 00:26 UTC. Comments added prior to January 2008 have been archived.

Contents 1 Cape Field at Fort Glenn 2 White Plains 3 WikiMapia 4 Speedy deletion of Template:FAA 5 Template:United States topic 6 Template:WikiMapia 7 Formatting of destinations in airport articles 8 Skyhaven Airport 9 Orphaned non-free media (Image:CLL logo.jpg) 10 Possibly unfree Image:ASU_Wainwright.jpg 11 AfD nomination of Twin Lakes Airport 12 Image copyright problem with Image:ABE logo.jpg 13 Category naming conventions for landforms 14 Franklin Municipal-John Beverly Rose Airport 15 Boscobel Airport/Aerodrome

[edit] Cape Field at Fort Glenn

Hi Zyxw -- I note you added to the article Cape Field at Fort Glenn. It certainly needed to be extended from the minimal stub that I had started the article with. But, I am concerned that the way you reference the new material, saying that the article now "includes" text from two sources that you provide. I appreciate that you do include the two sources as references. But if it includes text from another source, that text should be put in quotation marks or block quotes. I am not sure what to do now. I would rather not revert it back to the way it previously was. Could you edit the material to put into quotes the material that is the same as in the source? Or reword the information? Sincerely, doncram (talk) 20:11, 12 January 2008 (UTC)

As requested, I updated the Cape Field at Fort Glenn article to place quotes around text taken directly from the NHL summary. I also merged the two sets of references and restored the text regarding it being "a public domain work of the United States Government", and therefore acceptable include in a Wikipedia article. Since the NHL link is currently not working, I added a link to a cached version that can be found on Google. -- Zyxw (talk) 08:15, 13 January 2008 (UTC)

Thank you for responding to my request and for identifying clearly which text passages came from which of 2 sources (or that they duplicate both those sources). Thank you for adding in the link to the Google cache version of the NHL summary webpage, as that helps right now in our discussion. As you may have surmised because they lack author and date and otherwise, both the NL writeup and the NHL summary webpage for the site are not original, primary sources. (In fact, they are both based on a more fundamental document, the NRHP inventory/nomination document for the site, which is typically 10-20 pages long and is written by a historian. For most National Historic Landmarks, that document is available on-line at the National Park Service. I am putting in a request now to get a hard copy of that document sent to me, so that I can improve this article.) doncram (talk) 14:35, 13 January 2008 (UTC)

I restored a third reference which your editing had inadvertently deleted. As you may or may not be aware, the NRHP infobox appearing on this page is similar to infoboxes now appearing in many other NRHP articles in wikipedia, that are all based on one download on 1/23/2007 from the NRIS database. FYI, the download was performed by user Elkman, not myself. Please note that it is not appropriate to delete this source. doncram (talk) 14:35, 13 January 2008 (UTC)

I also re-edited the referencing to remove use of the "USGovernment" template. This is justified because every passage copied from a U.S. government source is now put in quotes and specifically referenced. It is then not necessary to raise doubt on the rest of the article. Since this is currently such a short article with so little original wording written by any wikipedia editors, that may seem superfluous to you. But my effort on fixing up the references in this article are intended to allow a longer article to grow, including use of other sources, which is fully referenced and not ever requiring that template. It is very painful, after an article has grown without keeping track of each statement's source, to go back and track down every source in order to remove that kind of generic disclaimer. doncram (talk) 14:35, 13 January 2008 (UTC)

This was my first encounter with the "USGovernment" template and its disclaimer, although I have seen some similar ones. As you may gather, I strongly dislike use of such general disclaimers and the kind of article-writing for which such disclaimers may be needed. To give you some background, there are approximately 1,600 wikipedia articles on National Historic Landmark sites, indexed in List of National Historic Landmarks by state, and there are several thousand articles on other National Register of Historic Places. As far as I can tell, none of these articles employ this "USGovernment" template and disclaimer. I have gone and checked the category "Category:Wikipedia articles incorporating text from public domain works of the United States Government" and am happy to notice no NHL or other NRHP articles listed there now, after this article is removed. It is the general practice, instead, to fully reference the sources used in an article and to avoid having to put in such a general disclaimer. It is my personal feeling that the disclaimer is tantamount to declaring "This is plagiarized", and I strongly want to avoid necessity of its use. You do not have to agree with the intensity of my feelings on this, but please understand that use of this USGovernment template on historic site articles is likely to be highly unappreciated by me and by others. I do understand you could have different views. I wouldn't mind further exchanging viewpoints on this if you like, but again, I trust you will agree that use of the disclaimer is unnecessary in this case. Sincerely, doncram (talk) 14:35, 13 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] White Plains

Thanks for finding all that FAA information for HPN, I wasn't even sure where to start looking for more to make it notable or any of the other issues. Travellingcari (talk) 06:16, 19 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] WikiMapia

I've put them all back I think. There may be 2 or 3 that I converted the infobox at the same time and didn't restore the map link. You were right, the majority were airports, edited/created by you last. I usually just use the infobox link to look and make sure that the coordinates were typed correctly and if I want to see the place better I use Google Earth. That's how I found the military airports in the US that have leading 0. GeoHack can use the "1:" but I've not used it very often. CambridgeBayWeather Have a gorilla 21:01, 1 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Speedy deletion of Template:FAA

A tag has been placed on Template:FAA requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. This has been done under section T3 of the criteria for speedy deletion, because it is a deprecated or orphaned template. After seven days, if it is still unused and the speedy deletion tag has not been removed, the template will be deleted.

If the template is intended to be substituted, please feel free to remove the speedy deletion tag and please consider putting a note on the template's page indicating that it is substituted so as to avoid any future mistakes.

Thanks. --MZMcBride (talk) 21:17, 4 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Template:United States topic

Hi -- "05:23, 6 March 2008 Zyxw (Talk | contribs) (6,317 bytes) (removed "line-height:1.4em;" from prior edit since it makes the lines too compressed -- use Template:Navbox defaults instead)" - except these defaults seem to space the lines a little too far apart. How about 1.5em? Sardanaphalus (talk) 08:30, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

I find that using "line-height:1.4em;" makes the text look crowded and I don't think using "line-height:1.5em;" is going to change that. However, my main concern with any such change in Template:United States topic is that there are thousands of other templates based on Template:Navbox which use the default line height. One of the reasons for using Navbox is to maintain some level of consistency, particularly for those articles containing multiple navigation boxes. Therefore, if the line height is changed, it should be changed at that level. I see you made such a request at Template talk:Navbox #Suggestions for default groupstyle/liststyle, groupNstyle/listNstyle and an admin denied it on March 2, stating the correct place for such changes is in MediaWiki:Common.css. I also see you then posted your suggestion at MediaWiki talk:Common.css #Extra CSS for Navboxes. I think you should wait for it to be resolved there instead of adding "line-height:1.4em;" to individual templates. -- Zyxw (talk) 14:50, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Template:WikiMapia

Re your recent addition of 1000+ WikiMapia links to Wikipedia articles: why are you trying to reverse the work done on WP:GEO after a clear consensus to stop using templates that exist only to link to external map services? All the Geolinks templates have stayed neutral after the clensing, so what makes WikiMapia so special that it should be the only templated service in Wikipedia articles? Yes, it has information Wikipedia articles mostly don't have, but so do all the 100 map services available through the coordinates link. --Para (talk) 23:48, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

I see you've created {{HybridMapLink}} for the same purpose. Would you mind explaining on WT:GEO? --Para (talk) 15:57, 4 April 2008 (UTC)

Hello. Sorry it took me this long to reply. I held off because your concerns about promoting one particular site over others caused me to think about designing a template that could replace Template:WikiMapia and all the other direct links to mapping sites. As you have already noticed, the result of that was Template:HybridMapLink. I haven't announced it anywhere since I've been testing it and updating the documentation. I'll post about it at WT:GEO and WT:EL shortly. In the meantime, here are some responses to your original comments:

• "what makes WikiMapia so special that it should be the only templated service in Wikipedia articles? Yes, it has information Wikipedia articles mostly don't have, but so do all the 100 map services available through the coordinates link."

I wanted a direct (one-click) link to interactive satellite imagery with an overlaid map. The need for hybrid mode reduces the selection from "100" services to 5 primary sources (Google Maps, Live Search Maps, MapQuest, Multimap, Yahoo! Maps) and 3 secondary sources using the Google Maps API (AcmeMapper, GeoNames, WikiMapia). I chose WikiMapia because it was the only one I could find that allows adding outlines around items of interest, with notations that include a link to the Wikipedia article. I did not create the template; I simply started using it for those reasons.

• "recent addition of 1000+ WikiMapia links to Wikipedia articles"

While I may have added 1000+ links, I wouldn't characterize them as recent. Most of those links are in airport articles created or updated over the course of eleven months from 6-Feb-2007 through 8-Jan-2008.

• "why are you trying to reverse the work done on WP:GEO"

I support the work of the Geographical coordinates WikiProject regarding improvements to Template:GeoTemplate (a.k.a. GeoHack) and have even contributed corrections to that template. However, for some people it can be a bit overwhelming. There are others who don't have a problem with it, but also want a direct link that goes from an article to a map in a single click. We do have the globe icon link for WikiMiniAtlas, which is nice but still a work in progress: it is slow, the satellite imagery is incomplete and it does not provide a way to specify a zoom level from within the article.

• "clear consensus to stop using templates that exist only to link to external map services"

Regardless of whether or not there was a consensus (the subject of some debate at Wikipedia talk:External links, one of the primary concerns seemed to be that placing external links in the article involved a choice between promoting one service (i.e. Template:WikiMapia) or having a large collection of links to different services (i.e. versions of Template:Geolinks-US-cityscale dated 3-Sep-2007 or earlier). Hopefully Template:HybridMapLink or something similar can address those concerns while still allowing a direct link to an external map service (until such time as WikiMiniAtlas improves or another solution is found).

-- Zyxw (talk) 15:13, 6 April 2008 (UTC)

I wish you had discussed it with people before putting so much work into creating a new template. I think it's a very bad idea to start multiple concurrent systems for the same purpose. If there really are enough Wikipedia readers who want "any map link", we should build on what we have and not start from scratch. A toolserver tool could for example be created that fetches the GeoHack page of an article and redirects to one of the first links. Then coordinates and scales and zoom sizes would only have to be entered once. But before starting any work on such a thing or spreading other templates around, please discuss the random link idea on GEO and EL. --Para (talk) 18:07, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Formatting of destinations in airport articles

EIELEF here: please, why are you modifiing the pages i've created?. It was a hard work, and the standard format isn't good. I know in an airport with 100 destinations, it would be long. But in most argentinean airports theere is only one airline and one destination. Putting the name of the airport isn't that bad idea. Please, do not change argentinean airports pages. I know LOTS of it (i live here, i'm a pilot here, and i've in almost all of those airports). Thanks a lot. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Eielef (talk • contribs) 13:05, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for creating new articles for the following airports in Argentina: Comandante Espora Airport, Brigadier General Bartolomé de la Colina International Airport, Coronel Felipe Varela International Airport and Resistencia International Airport. My edits involved adding references, correcting the format of the external links and reformatting the list of destinations based on the recommendations at Wikipedia:WikiProject Airports #Airport article structure. Regarding your request that I "do not change argentinean airports pages", see the official English Wikipedia policy titled Wikipedia:Ownership of articles, which states that "if you create or edit an article, know that others will edit it". Being a pilot located there who has visited most of those airports means you have a valuable contribution to make, but doesn't mean others won't edit your work. It is just one of those things you have to get used to as a contributor here. -- Zyxw (talk) 07:01, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Skyhaven Airport

Hi there. Just to let you know I moved your disambiguation page at Skyhaven Airport to Skyhaven Airport (disambiguation). Lordjeff06 (talk) 09:20, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for the heads up. However, the guidelines at Wikipedia: Disambiguation #Page naming conventions state that: Term ABC (disambiguation)" is not the mandatory name for a disambiguation page, and is only used when there is a primary topic for the title "Term ABC". It is acceptable, on the other hand, to create a page at "Term ABC (disambiguation)" that redirects to the disambiguation page at "Term ABC". Therefore, I moved the page back to its original location, causing Skyhaven Airport (disambiguation) to become a redirect to Skyhaven Airport. -- Zyxw (talk) 22:26, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

Fair enough. I figured that since only one of the Skyhaven airports listed had a wikipedia entry it might be the "primary topic for..." Then again, I don't know anything about any of those airports. Anyway, however you want to do it is obviously fine. Lordjeff06 (talk) 11:26, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Orphaned non-free media (Image:CLL logo.jpg)

Thanks for uploading Image:CLL logo.jpg. The media description page currently specifies that it is non-free and may only be used on Wikipedia under a claim of fair use. However, it is currently orphaned, meaning that it is not used in any articles on Wikipedia. If the media was previously in an article, please go to the article and see why it was removed. You may add it back if you think that that will be useful. However, please note that media for which a replacement could be created are not acceptable for use on Wikipedia (see our policy for non-free media).

If you have uploaded other unlicensed media, please check whether they're used in any articles or not. You can find a list of 'image' pages you have edited by clicking on the "my contributions" link (it is located at the very top of any Wikipedia page when you are logged in), and then selecting "Image" from the dropdown box. Note that all non-free media not used in any articles will be deleted after seven days, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. Thank you. BJBot (talk) 12:17, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

The image in question has been restored to the Easterwood Airport article. -- Zyxw (talk) 13:07, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Possibly unfree Image:ASU_Wainwright.jpg

An image that you uploaded or altered, Image:ASU_Wainwright.jpg, has been listed at Wikipedia:Possibly unfree images because its copyright status is disputed. If the image's copyright status cannot be verified, it may be deleted. You may find more information on the image description page. You are welcome to add comments to its entry at the discussion if you are interested in it not being deleted. Thank you. Kelly ^hi! 22:24, 31 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] AfD nomination of Twin Lakes Airport

I have nominated Twin Lakes Airport, an article you created, for deletion. I do not feel that this article satisfies Wikipedia's criteria for inclusion, and have explained why at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Twin Lakes Airport. Your opinions on the matter are welcome at that same discussion page; also, you are welcome to edit the article to address these concerns. Thank you for your time. Mister Senseless™ (Speak - Contributions) 00:47, 11 April 2008 (UTC)

I have responded to this at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Twin Lakes Airport. -- Zyxw (talk) 01:35, 11 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Image copyright problem with Image:ABE logo.jpg

Thanks for uploading Image:ABE logo.jpg. You've indicated that the image is being used under a claim of fair use, but you have not provided an adequate explanation for why it meets Wikipedia's requirements for such images. In particular, for each page the image is used on, the image must have an explanation linking to that page which explains why it needs to be used on that page. Can you please check

• That there is a non-free use rationale on the image's escription page for each article the image is used in.
• That every article it is used on is linked to from its description page.

The following images also have this problem:

• Image:AVP logo.png

This is an automated notice by FairuseBot. For assistance on the image use policy, see Wikipedia:Media copyright questions. --19:27, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

As per notices posted at Image:ABE logo.jpg and Image:AVP logo.png, this problem was caused by another user adding both images to the Hazelton, Pennsylvania article (see Revision as of 23:00, 8 January 2008). I removed the logos from the Hazleton article since they don't meet fair use requirements there. That should resolve the problem. -- Zyxw (talk) 02:21, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Category naming conventions for landforms

Hello, thanks for your note on my talk page. As far as I can remember, those two 2006 proposals that you cited were the only discussion locations for the in/of landform by country debate. I've also gone through the Wikipedia archive of my personal contributions and can't find that I made any other edits elsewhere regarding the matter. So, as you asked, to my knowledge these are the only two discussion points on the topic. All the best, Kurieeto (talk) 21:32, 29 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Franklin Municipal-John Beverly Rose Airport

I have reverted your move. The airport is listed by the FAA as Franklin Municipal-John Beverly Rose Airport , not the name you moved it too. Aiports are controlled by the FAA, a federal organization, not a state organization. Chrislk02 ^{Chris Kreider} 05:06, 17 May 2008 (UTC)

I have started a thread at wikiproject airports to see what the proper naming convention is when the official FAA name differs from what state and local authorities reference it as. The thread is here. Chrislk02 ^{Chris Kreider} 17:55, 17 May 2008 (UTC)

Hi. I was planning to post a response on your talk page, but since you started a new thread at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Airports#Airport naming conventions I have posted it there instead. -- Zyxw (talk) 18:32, 17 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Boscobel Airport/Aerodrome

There is a Boscobel Airport in Wisconsin and a Boscobel Aerodrome in Jamaica. How do you want to disambig them? - Canglesea (talk) 07:50, 8 June 2008 (UTC)

I changed Boscobel Airport from a redirect to an article about the Wisconsin airport and placed hatnotes at the top of each page (i.e. For the airport serving Ocho Rios, Jamaica, see Boscobel Aerodrome). I think that should be enough since there are only two airports and the names are not exactly the same. -- Zyxw (talk) 09:33, 9 June 2008 (UTC)