Talk:Michigan Womyn's Music Festival
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This article needs work. Perhaps some POV issues as well as curious phrases that do not appear to be in widespead use. --Dante Alighieri | Talk 01:31, May 4, 2005 (UTC)
What "curious phrases"? I'm not saying there aren't any, but I don't see them. On the other hand, I'm pretty much attuned to this sort of language, so it's possible that there are things in there that most people wouldn't understand that I just don't see. Izzycat 14:41, 15 December 2005 (UTC)
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[edit] The other one?
The text says "MWMF is one of two festivals with a womyn-born-womyn policy"
Does anyone know what the other one is? Just curious. It would be interesting to see if their policy is still current. - NickGorton 03:01, 13 August 2005 (UTC)
RadLesFest, probably. It would also likely shut down without the policy.
There is also a festival called "Women in the Woods" that has a WBW policy. There are most likely more, but the policy isn't necessarily published.
There's a women's music festival in Australia which also has a WBW policy. There are significantly more than two, but 'two' makes it sound like womyn-born-womyn-only festivals are a dying breed and therefore must be preserved, no matter who is excluded or whatever. Tall Girl 23:16, 19 August 2006 (UTC)
[edit] "Womyn"
Please keep the spelling of "women" consistent in the article (excluding references to the name, as it is a proper name). "Womyn" is not a word.
- When discussing MWMF, "womyn" and "womon" are the preferred spellings for "women" and "woman", respectively. Perhaps adding a section to discuss why those spellings are preferred so that people don't think they are misspellings is in order. -- Tall Girl 20:14, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
- When used in direct quotes the notation sic should be used to keep those who are not English as a primary language speakers from being confused at blatent and shameless misspellings. 172.128.45.15 22:26, 13 July 2006 (UTC)
- It's not a "blatant and shameless" misspelling, which is the point. Since, as the Wikipedia entry for sic points out, [sic] is used to indicate that something is incorrect, misspelled, or to expose the writer to ridicule, using [sic] isn't even appropriate. What is appropriate is using the words performed by the members of the community being discussed. There is an excellent discussion of womyn elsewhere on Wikipedia. I'd suggest a paragraph be added to this article explaning the use of that spelling in this context with a link to that article. One of the purposes of NPOV is making sure bias is eliminated. Since the organizers of MWMF themselves use womyn and womon themselves, the reasons for it being used should be presented, and the terms used by MWMF should be used. As the NPOV articles point out, the reader is then free to judge for themselves the validity, merit, etc. of the term. Tall Girl 13:00, 22 July 2006 (UTC)
- When used in direct quotes the notation sic should be used to keep those who are not English as a primary language speakers from being confused at blatent and shameless misspellings. 172.128.45.15 22:26, 13 July 2006 (UTC)
[edit] F2M
What about woman -> man transsexuals? They had the "Woman-Born-Woman experience."
re: FTM -- Well, actually, it's probably more accurate to say that they're having the "MAN-born-woman" experience, if they consider themselves men, and that's the issue. It's true that they were BORN female, but that's only half the equation. You need to ID as a woman now, AND have been born a female to fit the "woman-born-woman" definition. I hope that helps clarify the issue. :) Hyperjoy7
[edit] Layout
At present this article is very top-heavy, with everything above the first subheading comprising the bulk of the article. Unless someone objects strongly, I'm going to come back later and see what I can do to break things down into more sections and improve the flow. -- Tall Girl 20:19, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Location
This is the festival in Hart, Michigan, right? That is a bit silly to have an encyclopedia intentionally leave out relevant information because out of "courtesy." Not to mention offensive (and sexist) to claim that the consideration is for "safety." Members of a certain sex have known of the location for a long time without forming raiding parties to go looting and pillaging.—The preceding unsigned comment was added by 68.188.152.28 (talk • contribs) 05:51, 10 August 2006.
- Regardless, festival management and the women who are involved with the festival have requested that the whereabouts of the actual festival grounds not be published. Considering it is women who are making this request, dismissing it as "sexist" is misguided. Tall Girl 23:12, 19 August 2006 (UTC)
- The Church of Scientology has asked that information about it (including some of their locations) not be published anywhere. It's still on wikipedia because it's publicly available and verifiable information whether the CoS wants it published or not. The same principle stand here.
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- Furthermore, anyone set on harassing the festival is fully capable of exerting the small effort of doing a couple google searches and finding the exact location themselves, excluding the information from wikipedia isn't going to do anything for safety.Neitherday 00:10, 24 August 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Woman Born Woman Policy
Just wanted to note that the policy is still in effect. I just looked on the bullentins at the MWMF website. A press release was put out by Lisa Vogel on August 22, 2006 affirming this policy. For this reason, I'm cutting the line that states that the policy was ended in 2006. Dawns53715 03:13, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
- Neither the article nor the website makes this plain, but I assume this means that men are forbidden to attend, correct? Wachholder 19:03, 9 August 2007 (UTC)
- Yes, it is still a festival for women. The policy is still declared to be in place, but out transwomen are being sold tickets (and that is why Lesbians on Exstacy agreed to play). I think the article should more closely reflect the reality of the situation. I'm making changes, although I feel a little iffy about my ability to cite. RapunzelSaves (talk) 05:33, 23 February 2008 (UTC)
[edit] Wristbands
The wristband paragraph was motivated more designed to start a movement than to discuss an existing one. It also made obvious POV statements. I removed it. Neitherday 04:34, 20 September 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Adjusted the womyn born womyn section
The critism area had both support and against the policy info, so I broke them up... It reads better ---Womyn2me —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.228.122.18 (talk) 03:40, 19 January 2007 (UTC).
[edit] changed community meetings part
Added the word "worker" to the community decision paragraph, other wise it sounds like we have festi-goer community meetings for community decision making.... 159.140.254.10 18:32, 25 July 2007 (UTC)Womyn2me
[edit] NPOV template
I notice 68.189.89.230 (talk · contribs) added a neutrality template to this article without any discussion as to what they see as POV in the article. They have only made 3 edits (including adding the template). Without knowing what problem they have with the article, it is impossible to fix it. I'm removing the template. If anyone can come up with a reason to readd it, go ahead. But if you do readd it, please give a brief explanation here as to the reasoning. Neitherday 22:30, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Theory Regarding Application of the WBW Policy
I added clean-up and original research tags to the section. The section itself sets forth to advance one person's theory, and as such should be removed per WP:OR. But, before that I'd like to see what others think and if anyone believes that there is something that can be salvaged. Neitherday 18:38, 9 September 2007 (UTC)
[edit] newbie wants to add citations, but not problems
i am new to wiki in general & editing in particular. i'd like to add citations/references to magazine articles that, in my humble opinion, illustrate or further define phrases and concepts in the mich-fest article. at the same time, i don't want to cause more problems or offend 'style', especially if the periodicals i'm thinking of, such as velvet park magazine, will be perceived as inappropriate. all suggestions appreciated. Flatbed flirt (talk) 01:21, 26 May 2008 (UTC)
