Talk:Jim McGreevey
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[edit] First Gay Governor?
Governor. That has simply not occurred yet.
Certainly there have been many, many closeted gays in office over the years who have also been outed. So I don't think this individual deserves the distinction awarded to him.
Sorry.
--69.37.38.64 12:19, 22 September 2007 (UTC)
Read a little closer: That's Openly gay there, chief. Aceholiday (talk) 17:35, 11 March 2008 (UTC)
[edit] chronology/facts
-- to be incorporated (for use when newscycle slowdown permits update)
born: Jersey City, New Jersey
education: St. Joseph's High School
Columbia University (undergrad) 1978
Georgetown University (law) 1981
Harvard University (masters in education) 1982
offices: New Jersey Assembly 1990-1
Mayor of Woodbridge 1991-4
New Jersey Senate 1994-7
New Jersey Governor 2001-4 (resigned 8/12/2004 due to extramarital affair with a man)
First wife: ?Kari Schutz?
[edit] Resignation speech
I added about 95% of the speech to the article discounting some irrelevant points. I will yield to the community now to see which portions may be irrelevant to the article. Arminius 22:37, 12 Aug 2004 (UTC)
- I added a link to the text of the speech for those who do not believe it belongs in the article itself.Arminius 22:46, 12 Aug 2004 (UTC)
[edit] Resignation
Why did he delay the date of his resignation to November? --Patricknoddy 20:49, 13 Aug 2004 (UTC)User:Patricknoddy User talk:Patricknoddy 16:49 August 13, 2004 (EDT)
McGreevey delayed the effective date of his resignation to November 2004 in order to avoid forcing a special election, thereby allowing fellow Democrat and New Jersey Senate President Richard Codey to serve out McGreevey's term. Codey, who had served as acting governor before McGreevey's inauguration, will become acting governor again until the next general election in 2005. (Meelar forgot to sign).
- It isn't certain McGreevey will be allowed to delay his resignation that long. Most Jersey papers, many politicians and The New York Times are calling for him to resign sooner. -- Cecropia | Talk 20:53, 13 Aug 2004 (UTC)
McGreevy needs to let the voters decide who will lead the state until the 2005 elections - so he needs to STEP DOWN NOW (not wait until Nov 15 2004)!
If Mcreevey waits until Nov 15 2003 he will deprive the voters of their right to elect who will govern the state - he made that Nov 15 2004 date for selfish, political reasons and he made a backroom deal to help himself. He needs to do the right thing and STEP DOWN NOW!
- He needs to grow a set and stay in office. He's out. It's no longer a secret, and potential blackmailers no longer have anything on him. [[User:Nricardo|--Nelson Ricardo >>Talk<<]] 07:35, Sep 12, 2004 (UTC)
He's already past the deadline for a new election, and the fact that he has not submitted any paperwork regarding resignation may well be a sign that he'll have to be dragged kicking and screaming from Drumthwacket. Announcing your intent to resign ("I have decided the right course of action is to resign. To facilitate a responsible transition my resignation will be effective on November 15th of his year.") isn't the same as resigning. - Nunh-huh 07:45, 12 Sep 2004 (UTC)
[edit] Or not?
McGreevey has not yet sent in his letter of resignation to Secretary Thomas. - Calmypal 17:07, Sep 13, 2004 (UTC)
[edit] Openly gay
The further edit Moncrief made is fine. My point is that the previous wording, to the unitiated reader, implied that he was either openly gay when elected or not long after attaining office. That further implies that his "gayness" was tolerated by the public until his affair came to light. In fact he didn't become "openly gay" until the issue was forced, He would have been in a difficult position if he continued to represent himself as straight (which he did by virtue of his marriage to a woman). So I would say he was didn't come out of the closet, he was forced out, and that is not openly gay, IMO. -- Cecropia | explains it all ® 08:30, 23 Nov 2004 (UTC)
Moncrief, your further change is also OK by me. It removes the ambiguity (I think) of when and how he "came out." Howver, I'm a little uncomfortable with characterizing him as an "openly gay governor," because his openness and resignation went hand in hand, so we'll never know how the electorate felt about his gayness, since it is bound up in scandal and resignation. -- Cecropia | explains it all ® 08:34, 23 Nov 2004 (UTC)
- Cecropia, I understand your points but for the purpose of the introductory paragraph of the article, I think keeping it simple and accurate is the most important thing. Regardless of the electorate's opinions, how he came out of the closet and all of the other details, the fact is that he was openly gay (i.e., he acknowledged that he was gay) while serving as governor of New Jersey and he continued serving as governor of New Jersey while being openly gay. The other details belong, if you want to add them, in later paragraphs. I understand that he would rather have not come out, that he was not elected while he was openly gay and everything else you've said, but the truth is that he was openly gay for several months while in office - and this is the simple distillation of the reality that belongs in the lead paragraph, I think: that he was the first and to date only openly gay state governor in US history. I'm glad we've come to an acceptable compromise. Moncrief 08:47, Nov 23, 2004 (UTC)
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- Why is the majority of the article about the fact that he is gay?? Why a whole section dedicated to who he is dating?? This is highly slanted and unbalanced. I don't see other articles about governors that focus so much on this sexual preferences and who he is dating. Let's revise and balance.24.10.184.204 03:47, 8 July 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Trivia
I have added trivia about the soap opera One Life to Live. It comes from Soap Opera Digest Magazine. User:Dowew May 17, 2005
There is at least one other openly gay "governmental leader" in the US. The mayor of Providence, Rhode Island, David Cicilline, is openly gay.
[edit] Gay Government Leaders
For the internationally savvy, have there ever been any gay prime ministers or governors in any states / provinces anywhere else in the world? user:J.J.
- Here's the wiki page on it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_the_first_LGBT_holders_of_political_offices. How complete this is is anybody's guess.VatoFirme (talk) 18:59, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
[edit] Succession box
I reverted edits that were made to the succession box. Please note, following Donald DiFrancesco, the office was occupied by Acting Governors John Farmer Jr., John O. Bennett, and Richard Codey. Accurizer 16:55, 1 May 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Morag? WTF? =
Can anyone verify his daughter is named "Morag"? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.15.9.228 (talk • contribs)
- "Morag Veronica", according to this ABILITY Magazine article. Accurizer 23:06, 4 October 2006 (UTC)
[edit] First wife Karen "Kari" Joan Schutz
I find this article on Jim McGreevey to be extremely lacking in one regard - there is absolutely no mention of why his first marriage broke up. Is it because his first wife found out that he was a homosexual? I mean, she just got up and moved to British Columbia - almost as if she was trying to move her and their daughter as far away from him as possible. Is it a big secret? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.129.139.97 (talk) 07:17, 30 March 2008 (UTC)
[edit] "Gay" vs. "homofecal"
NPOV and basic accuracy demand the most precise terminology available. Without making any value judgements, it is reasonable to point out that "gay" is an imprecise term at best (at the time, McGreevey identified as heterosexual) and by all accounts the affair was purely physical rather than emotional.
Such physical intercourse without an emotional component is colloquially referred to as "homosexual" rather than "gay". However this is not precise either, since "sex" is not possible in the technical sense between two males. Hence "homofecal" is sometimes used as a substitute. See for instance http://www.virtueonline.org/portal/modules/news/article.php?storyid=1799
I want to make it clear that I have nothing against homosexuals/gay people. If this had been an affair between two self-identified gay/homosexual people, that would be one thing. Since this is not the case, my edit gay-> homofecal has the virtue of accuracy. This can be debated one way or the other, but it was certainly not vandalism as alansohn falsely termed it, and should not be labeled as such.
Watcher On The Wall 16:23, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
- I'll play it straight (no pun intended, not that there's anything wrong with that). First of all, the change you made was from "extramarital" to "homofecal"; you did not change the word "gay". There is no source found that describes McGreevey's relationship as "homofecal". The link you have provided as a "source" is the only usage of the term found by Google, and the term was used by an individual posting it in response to a blog post to slam "Episcopagans" for their acceptance of the practice. If you insist on using the term, you're going to have to come up with far better sources to demonstrate that the term has any validity. Until then, I'll stick with "vandalism" when I see the term "homofecal" used. Alansohn 16:43, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
- Alansohn is correct. This is vandalism masquerading as something academic. --David Shankbone 16:45, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
Wow, really? Nothing against gays? Not vandalism? Yet you claim gay sex is "impossible" (I assure you it is quite possible), and you want to describe someone with a term that has the word "fecal" (i.e. "shit") in it. And it's a word you got from an anti-gay discussion on a religious website. A discussion in which the user of the term is claiming gay sex is wrong and sinful.
Wow. Just, wow.VatoFirme (talk) 18:54, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
[edit] Divorce trial
I added this start of divorce: Jim and Dina Matos McGreevey's divorce trial in the Union County Courthouse in Elizabeth, started on May 6, 2008, to end their 3 1/2-year separation. Jim asked the court for equal custody of their 6-year-old daughter, alimony and child support. Matos McGreevey demanded $ 600,000 compensation. McGreevey, 50, now lives with a male partner and is studying to be an Episcopal priest. Stephen Haller, his lawyer will present witness Teddy Pedersen, 29: "Plaintiff will testify at trial that he needed to have a disrobed male present in the room with them in order for him to become physically aroused; This tends to prove that plaintiff was at least bisexual, a fact which should have been obvious to defendant prior to the marriage." Matos McGreevey's lawyer John Post, would block Pedersen's testimony.[1][2] --Florentino floro (talk) 09:18, 6 May 2008 (UTC)
[edit] FEMA
What does FEMA have to do with this?
In her memoirs, Matos wrote that she would never have married McGreevey if she had known he was gay, nor would she have chosen to have a gay man to father her child.[70] On March 17, 2008, Theodore Pedersen, a former aide to McGreevey, claimed that from 1999 to 2001 he had a three-way affair with McGreevey and Matos, a statement later affirmed by email from McGreevey to the Associated Press. That claim has been recently affirmed by FEMA.[70][71] In a statement to ABC News, Matos denied that a threesome ever took place.[72]
JBFrenchhorn (talk) 06:44, 22 May 2008 (UTC)
