Talk:Aldred

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	Aldred has been listed as one of the Philosophy and religion good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can delist it, or ask for a reassessment.
Article milestones Date Process Result January 27, 2008 Good article nominee Listed April 25, 2008 Peer review Reviewed Current Status: Good article

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[edit] GA review

I have begun to review the article. I will post my initial comments within the next 48 hours. Cheers, Majoreditor (talk) 22:44, 25 January 2008 (UTC)

The article has two statements which require citations:

• When King Edward died, some sources state that it was Aldred that crowned Harold Godwinson as King of England.
  • The statement is sourced down below, in the second paragraph of the Archbishop of York section. If you wish, i can cite the source in the lede also. Ealdgyth | Talk 22:25, 26 January 2008 (UTC)
• Aldred probably was from the west of England, and possibly was related to Lyfing, his predecessor as bishop of Worcester.
  • That sentence and the following one came from the same source, so it's only souced at the end, per usual usage. If you want I can of course duplicate the footnote. Ealdgyth | Talk 22:25, 26 January 2008 (UTC)

• • • Good suggestions. Please cite the first in the lead and duplicate the second. Majoreditor (talk) 04:55, 27 January 2008 (UTC)
      • Taken care of. Ealdgyth | Talk 05:16, 27 January 2008 (UTC)

More comments to follow. Majoreditor (talk) 17:01, 26 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Comments

Good work. The article is very close to passing GA review. It passes criteria 2 through 6:

2. It is factually accurate and verifiable.

a (references): Y b (citations to reliable sources): Y (pending above) c (OR): Y

3. It is broad in its coverage.

a (major aspects): Y b (focused): Y

4. It follows the neutral point of view policy.

Fair representation without bias: Y

5. It is stable.

No edit wars etc.: Y

6. It is illustrated by images, where possible and appropriate.

a (images are tagged and non-free images have fair use rationales): Y

b (appropriate use with suitable captions): Y

However, there are criterion #1 concerns:

• a: The article's prose are marginal. The diction and tone are occasionally stilted, reading like a superannuated textbook. It's not severe enough to warrant GA failure; however, the article will need extensive wordsmithing if it's to eventually reach FA status. I am going to ask you to re-craft one particular sentence: But though often at court,[24] Aldred seems to have been no sympathiser with Norman oppression, and is even said to have bearded the king himself.

I haven't liked that sentence since I started working on the page. I think it's a refugee from the 1911 Britannica. Reworking. Anything else you saw that cries out? Ealdgyth | Talk 05:11, 27 January 2008 (UTC)

Done. I just removed it, it was ugly and awkward and I cannot find a source for the statement in either Douglas' William the Conqueror or in Barlow's English Church, thus probably from 1911 and better off gone. Ealdgyth | Talk 05:16, 27 January 2008 (UTC)

That's sufficient, thanks. Majoreditor (talk) 05:31, 27 January 2008 (UTC)

• b: MOS: Please clean up both in-citations and references so they conform to MoS.

Hm. Can you be more specific? As far as I can tell, it does conform to MoS. They are consistent, and use <ref></ref>WP:CITE does not specifiy a specific style of citation or the use of citation templates, just that it be consistent. Or at least that's what I'm reading. I'll freely admit I might have missed something buried somewhere.Ealdgyth | Talk 05:11, 27 January 2008 (UTC)

The issue is lack of proper punctuation in the notes. There's lesser issues with punctuation in the references. See WP:CITE/ES for examples, and MLA style and Harvard referencing for specifics. I'll check back tomorrow. Cheers, Majoreditor (talk) 05:31, 27 January 2008 (UTC)

Completely redone to what I think you're asking for. I'm still not totally sure if you were wanting separate notes and references or what. Decided to just go with full citation on each footnote and nix the bibliography. Ealdgyth | Talk 06:45, 27 January 2008 (UTC)

I am placing the GA review on hold pending the changes. I'll be happy to pass it once these concerns are addressed. Cheers, Majoreditor (talk) 04:55, 27 January 2008 (UTC)

Nice work, Ealdgyth. The article pasees criterion #1. There are no major MoS issues. The prose are passable but far from brilliant. I've wordsmithed a few phrases and encourage the article's editors to sharpen the prose even further.

I am passing the article for GA. Majoreditor (talk) 20:23, 27 January 2008 (UTC)

Thanks, and thanks for the wordsmithing. It's always hard to see the problems in your own prose or in prose you've stared at for a long time. Ealdgyth | Talk 20:45, 27 January 2008 (UTC)